distractionware forums

VVVVVV => VVVVVV Levels => Topic started by: FIQ on May 28, 2012, 01:41:51 PM

Title: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.3)
Post by: FIQ on May 28, 2012, 01:41:51 PM
The level's scripting is one big mess (part due to me, but mostly due to the scripting engine's very limited flexibility). If you're trying to figure out how I did a specific thing, I'm always open to answer stuff like that in PM. That way, we don't have to clutter this thread with that kind of stuff. Thank you in advance!

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6 months has passed since Viridian and his crew left Dimension VVVVVV, and they are at their ship, when Vermilion suddenly goes missing. Soon, you get a communication signal from Dimension VVVVVV. Apparently Vermilion managed to teleport back there. But it's not empty of people anymore!
You find a person that calls himself Vita. Vita requests you to go and turn on devices that he calls "power sources", that provides power to a new Dimension Stability Generator, that finally will put an end to the always apparent danger of collapse of the dimension. This new version of the generator will not emit the signals from the old one that interferes to some ships (like D.S.S. Souleye).

Will you find all the power sources, and will the generator work? Play the level to know!

"... I am amazed by what has managed to be done in this level" - Blatch (http://distractionware.com/forum/index.php?topic=1003.msg8373#msg8373)

"... This level is truly a masterpiece of levels" - Riosha (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ihx9tYKE37Y&t=20m46s)

The levels feature 4+2 levels, and an overworld.

Screenshots (from an old beta, things have changed very slightly since):
(http://i46.tinypic.com/143hrbt.png)

(http://i46.tinypic.com/ruv2o2.png)

(http://i49.tinypic.com/z1ezk.png)

(http://i45.tinypic.com/2lt24v7.png)

(http://i48.tinypic.com/34r6hb6.png)

(http://i49.tinypic.com/35ksj77.png)


And an example of what I managed with scripts, possible to access by a code:

(http://i.imgur.com/aAwggrp.png)

Note that the level features heavy use of internal scripting. If there's ever a new release of VVVVVV fixing this bug, this level will not work anymore.

FEATURES:
* A modified Dimension VVVVVV
* A new character
* A new story
* Something else than rescuing crewmates
* Trinkets! Woo!
* Internal scripting (the first level who did it that also works in 2.1!)
* Teleport system, like the one in the main game
* Levels are connected to an overworld, just like in the real game or 333333
* Some of the bugs in Dimension VVVVVV which carries over to this level was fixed (for example the music issue in 2.0)

CHANGELOG:
Version 1.2.3 released 2016-04-15:
* The Super Gravitron is no longer accessible under Invincibility Mode

Version 1.2.2 released 2013-06-17 (483 downloads total):
* Fixed completing the first part of the level unlocking Flip Mode
* Fixed typos: instable->unstable, (...) sound too well... -> (...) sound too good...
* Fixed a minor tiling error in Inversed Floors
* Moved T4 slightly to the right
* Decreased the amount of teleporters to get an extra challenge trinket from max 2 to max 1.

Version 1.2.1 released 2013-02-18 (223 downloads total):
* Fixed a typo in the last dialog before the level ends
* Improved the dialog at the end to point out that the level will end immediately afterwards, and should you want to explore more, you're recommended to save
* Nerfed trinket challenges in Dimensional Tunnel
* Moved the DT challenge explanation terminal to the right side, to prevent users from accidentally skipping the first trinket (Riosha did this twice and I don't think it was intended)

Version 1.2 released 2013-02-16 (3 downloads total):
* Fixed clearing Platform Arena playing a flip sound effect instead of the level complete song in some cirumstances
* Fixed using TD resulting in "Level part completed! @ Life Factory" dialog if you had Potential for Anything activated in jukebox
* Altered the terminal in Crossway to give a more useful hint for 2.0 users.
* Made trinket locator usable for 2.0 users
* Made a room right of the trinket locator which you can use to check which trinkets you've found and which you miss currently
* Made the terminal in Crossway usable for 2.0 users
* Made a trinket room available before the end
* Made a TF pointing to the second dimensional tunnel (disabled before you complete the first phase of the level)
* Created a visible divot in Teleporter Divot
* Made *all* rooms in Dimensional Tunnel "wrap", there used to be a few rooms which didn't.
* Fixed a bug in which Vitellary (and possibly Vita) would disappear when choosing teleporter destination.
* Cheat code system. Codes are listed at the ship.
* Altered Into The Platform Arena slightly.
* Buffed Flip Training
* Nerfed Better Safe Than Sorry, Right?
* Fixed a typo in a roomname (Walk Agsint The Flow -> Walk Against The Flow)
* Placed checkpoints in DT (polar -> VVVVVV) at the trinket paths to make you walk less
* Placed several new checkpoints in the overworld to prevent dying in the few spots you can die at taking you to somewhere else far away
* Made a terminal at DT before the trinkets which comments a little on them, just for fun
* Made several script optimizations to account for hard limit of 500 scripts per level
* Fixed several typos
* Fixed a bug in the initial cutscene that made text boxes not show up correctly, and then crash VVVVVV if you button mash ACTION
* Removed an enemy in Easier Than it Looks to prevent dying by sheer (un)luck (this isn't a nerf in practice)
* Added persistent Vermilion at the ship, explaining the gravitron terminals.
* Added a 22nd trinket challenge -- complete the game (activate polar PS with 20 trinkets) and only ever activate destination teleporters in the hub personally 2 times

Version 1.1 released 2012-11-10 (86 downloads total):
* Fixed grammatical errors in "PS activated!" text
* Changed some internal scripts to use the "internal scripting w/o cutscenebars" method
* Trinket room! Yay!
* Jukebox terminals in secret area is reusable now
* The secret area now remembers which music it played last
* The jukebox at the end of the game will also remember what music it played last
* Fixed "Press ACTION to activate terminal" at the beginning
* Changed the background of the alternative path in Life Factory
* You can't die in Secret Area anymore (by enemies from Platform Arena)
* Terminals in Control Area that set destination is reusable now
* Fixed a major bug letting you get infinite trinkets
* Moved the terminals in the center "Control Area" to fix an occasional glitch
* Made a trinket more interesting. As this resulted in moving a trinket, and due to how VVVVVV handles entities in custom levels, this WILL break saves (unless you collected all, or no, trinkets)
* Made a place in overworld less frustrating

Version 1.0 released 2012-10-14:
* DIY VI Repair works. For sure this time! Really! I hope so...
* Saving in gravitrons works
* There's now a disclaimer in the ship about gravitron chaining
* There isn't random terminals missing in the ship anymore
* There's a little monologue right before ending the level to "justify" rescuing Victoria
* You cannot get the wrong music playing without editing the save file manually now. Eheheh... (Also, this "bug" exists in the main game in some places :3)
* Proper credits info
* The ship map coordinates is hidden until the ending now. Also hides the teleporter hub before you go there by yourself
* Made a very minor nerf to Spike Pit
* There isn't any obvious internal script trigger in the polar dimension entry anymore
* Fixed possibility to die in the secret area due to Inversed Floors being right above it (this wasn't supposed to be possible)
* Ship jukebox semi-works. I've yet to find out exactly how to light terminals manually, but you should at least be able to trigger them more than once now.
* Fixed VVVVVV 2.0 bug related to music stopping (mostly seen in time trial in the original game) affecting two of my internal scripts.
* Fixed a less brutal respawn if you manage to die after doing the first part of the dimension story without hitting a checkpoint.
* The locator now acknowledges the lack of a map in VVVVVV 2.0. I can't really do more than saying that 2.1 is recommended there, though...

Beta 2c released 2012-06-18:
* Fixed glitches related to the power source in the polar dimension
* You can now save at gravitrons you usually can't save at, w/o random bugs occurring
* Fixed easter egg glitching the plot

Beta 2b released 2012-06-15:
* Fixed a major bug that made it possible to skip Inversed Floors

Beta 2a released 2012-06-15:
* True ending
* Added new level - Inversed Floors
* Added "secret" area accessible after turning on every power source
* Added true ending (but the end is unfinished, you can go and clear the level now, but there's no dialogs at the "end" end!)
* Nerfed Platform Arena
* Added 4 new trinkets (2 in Inversed Floors, 2 in secret area)
* Added a new game at the end area (don't try to run the normal one, then the "special" one directly after it! I might remove it alltogether due to these bugs
* The whole dimension is filled now! Yay!

Beta 1b released 2012-05-28:
* Fixed major bug that made the game unwinnable if you chose Life Factory as your last level

Beta 1a released 2012-05-28:
* Added the whole level except for one level
* Nerfed Spike Pit
* Nerfed You Though It Was Easy?
* Nerfed Narrow Path

Fragment:
* First level, includes Life Factory
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: ToasterApocalypse on May 29, 2012, 02:20:33 AM
I can't wait! I've been looking forward to this since the fragment.

Suspense kills. I have to find out what Vita looks like :o
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: LucasK on May 31, 2012, 11:33:42 AM
That looks nice! I can wait for it.   :)
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on June 08, 2012, 07:58:34 PM
Apparently I suck at estimations.
Anyway, the scripts are finally done!

A link is going up very soon (~10min), just doing a final playtesting of everything for myself to avoid major bugs!

EDIT: Found one, but it's fixed.

The beta is released!

Check the main post for the file
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: LucasK on June 09, 2012, 06:05:22 AM
Nice! Going to play it right now.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on June 09, 2012, 06:10:29 AM
Nice! Going to play it right now.
Read the first post again thanks, if the file is named "vvvvvv.zip", you'll have to download it again. Sorry!
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: ToasterApocalypse on June 09, 2012, 06:27:21 AM
Now to go in and exploit EVERY
LAST
BUG

(If there's any.  :-X)

EDIT: Played, but not beaten.
I am horrible at navigating.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on June 09, 2012, 06:30:41 AM
Oh, by the way, to people who love the R button: It can break several parts of the level. I don't intend to fix anything related to it (actually, in 2.0, when you could use R in the main game, it glitched many parts of it as well). Just only use it if you get stuck in a platform (god, I don't understand why this happens anyway...)
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: ToasterApocalypse on June 09, 2012, 10:26:20 AM
Beat the game with 465 deaths, and ten trinkets.

Are you Terry or something, because that scripting blew my mind.

(And broke it. Seriously? You even got the gravitron in there.)
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: LucasK on June 09, 2012, 10:44:12 AM
True, The scripting in this level is just...geniously used.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on June 09, 2012, 11:31:57 AM
Hehe, thanks.

When Stalefish first found out about a bug that could be utilized to access the internal scripting engine in 2.0 (which was fixed in 2.1), I played around with it.

I played around with the custom level parser, and stumbled upon a new way to do it entirely by mistake - and it even worked better than expected. I was able to trick the parser into believing that the following 5 lines (infinite in 2.1, but I wanted to make this level 2.0 compatible) would be a part of a say command, while it *actually* would be parsed directly by the internal engine, just as the normal game. Then, by abusing the internal text() command, I could change it into something that let me do this *indefinitely*.

I didn't decompile the game or anything, but I opened the binary in a text editor, to see how scripts looked in the normal game, and from that, and a lot of experimentation, I did this level.

There's probably some quirkiness in there, things that I did in the "wrong" way, but it worked!

About the gravitron, it was just a fun thing to implement, as it was accessible by a single command :P

You can open it up in a level editor and see for yourself how I did it.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: ToasterApocalypse on June 09, 2012, 11:37:52 AM
Hehe, thanks.

When Stalefish first found out about a bug that could be utilized to access the internal scripting engine in 2.0 (which was fixed in 2.1), I played around with it.

I played around with the custom level parser, and stumbled upon a new way to do it entirely by mistake - and it even worked better than expected. I was able to trick the parser into believing that the following 5 lines (infinite in 2.1, but I wanted to make this level 2.0 compatible) would be a part of a say command, while it *actually* would be parsed directly by the internal engine, just as the normal game. Then, by abusing the text() command, I could change it into something that let me do this *indefinitely*.

I didn't decompile the game or anything, but I opened the binary in a text editor, to see how scripts looked in the normal game, and from that, and a lot of experimentation, I did this level.

There's probably some quirkiness in there, things that I did in the "wrong" way, but it worked!

About the gravitron, it was just a fun thing to implement, as it was accessible by a single command :P

You can open it up in a level editor and see for yourself how I did it.

I did open it, and looked at the gravitron script

but I don't know what script it was.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on June 09, 2012, 11:39:49 AM
It's named "gravitron".

I do however (as always) recommend against using any kind of internal scripting unless you know exactly what you're doing, AND, are aware that it might be patched sooner or later.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: LucasK on June 09, 2012, 11:45:31 AM
OMG i copied the gravitron script into a level with just blank space to test it. And The Gravitron worked properly! That's cool!
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on June 09, 2012, 11:45:56 AM
Beat the game with 465 deaths, and ten trinkets.

Are you Terry or something, because that scripting blew my mind.

(And broke it. Seriously? You even got the gravitron in there.)
Which room was hardest?
That would be good information, because if the room you specify doesn't make sense for me, that might tell me that that room is too hard or things like that.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on June 09, 2012, 11:47:07 AM
OMG i copied the gravitron script into a level with just blank space to test it. And The Gravitron worked properly! That's cool!
Be aware that The Gravitron expects a gravity line to be placed in the right spot, or it will crash the game (This is also the case when exploiting the bug that enabled you to skip the gravitron in the normal game, by quicksaving)
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: ToasterApocalypse on June 09, 2012, 11:58:04 AM
Beat the game with 465 deaths, and ten trinkets.

Are you Terry or something, because that scripting blew my mind.

(And broke it. Seriously? You even got the gravitron in there.)
Which room was hardest?
That would be good information, because if the room you specify doesn't make sense for me, that might tell me that that room is too hard or things like that.

Even with the nerf, narrow path was still a god awful room for me. But I'm horrible at gaming, sooo...  :viridian:

I did struggle with the second dimension tunnel too.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on June 09, 2012, 12:12:26 PM
Beat the game with 465 deaths, and ten trinkets.

Are you Terry or something, because that scripting blew my mind.

(And broke it. Seriously? You even got the gravitron in there.)
Which room was hardest?
That would be good information, because if the room you specify doesn't make sense for me, that might tell me that that room is too hard or things like that.

Even with the nerf, narrow path was still a god awful room for me. But I'm horrible at gaming, sooo...  :viridian:

I did struggle with the second dimension tunnel too.
OK. Thanks for the feedback!

With the second dimension tunnel, do you mean the normal path or the trinket path?
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: ToasterApocalypse on June 10, 2012, 06:42:54 AM
Beat the game with 465 deaths, and ten trinkets.

Are you Terry or something, because that scripting blew my mind.

(And broke it. Seriously? You even got the gravitron in there.)
Which room was hardest?
That would be good information, because if the room you specify doesn't make sense for me, that might tell me that that room is too hard or things like that.

Even with the nerf, narrow path was still a god awful room for me. But I'm horrible at gaming, sooo...  :viridian:

I did struggle with the second dimension tunnel too.
OK. Thanks for the feedback!

With the second dimension tunnel, do you mean the normal path or the trinket path?

The normal path. The actual difficulty wasn't much. It was just memorising(Spelling?) the location of the spikes/enemies.

EDIT: I also died about 200 times in the platform arena  :D
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on June 10, 2012, 06:56:54 AM
Ah, maybe I made the arena too hard then.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: ToasterApocalypse on June 10, 2012, 07:03:15 AM
Hm, maybe.

The gravitron script works like a charm, by the way. I just tested it on one of my own levels that won't get released on the forums, probably.

gotoroom, though... How does that one work?
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on June 10, 2012, 07:23:11 AM
gotoroom(x,y) send you to another room. The parameters are: x - the x coordinate, and y - the y coordinate. These start from 0, not 1 as the level editor, i.e. room 3,9 in the level editor is accessed by gotoroom(2,8).

This is best combined with gotoposition(x,y) to place Viridian in a specific part of the room (if you don't use this, he will change room but keep the same position as in the room before, and might end up in walls, etc).

Example:
gotoroom(4,9)
gotoposition(148,88)

(and the usual disclaimer about internal scripts apply :p)
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: ToasterApocalypse on June 10, 2012, 07:26:28 AM
gotoroom(x,y) send you to another room. The parameters are: x - the x coordinate, and y - the y coordinate. These start from 0, not 1 as the level editor, i.e. room 3,9 in the level editor is accessed by gotoroom(2,8).

This is best combined with gotoposition(x,y) to place Viridian in a specific part of the room (if you don't use this, he will change room but keep the same position as in the room before, and might end up in walls, etc).

Example:
gotoroom(4,9)
gotoposition(148,88)

(and the usual disclaimer about internal scripts apply :p)

Internal scripts, eh? Explains why I can't/don't know how to use it.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: LucasK on June 10, 2012, 07:28:58 AM
hm...If you played with the scripting and got the Gravitron, maybe there's a way of doing the Tower by using it?
That would explode my mind.  :verdigris:

Also, can i implement the gravitron in my level by using that code? I'll credit you!  :viridian:
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on June 10, 2012, 07:43:01 AM
hm...If you played with the scripting and got the Gravitron, maybe there's a way of doing the Tower by using it?
That would explode my mind.  :verdigris:

Also, can i implement the gravitron in my level by using that code? I'll credit you!  :viridian:
Sure, but you know what patches will do..

About the tower, I tried. I really did.
I believed that tower mode was accessible by accessing a thing that the game calls a "game state". Gamestates is used for many things, and is identified by a number. For example, running gamestate 10 turns on the gravitron mode, gamestate 1001 will run the "hey, you found a shiny trinket!" script, and so on. This however isn't the case (or I've just failed to access the right one) with tower mode. Changing the game's gamestate is probably the most powerful thing that scripts can do, but it simply isn't enough.

First at all, towers use a special tileset, tiles3.png. This is arranged in a different way compared to tiles.png and tiles2.png (the first one for space station, the second for everything else). Only *accessing* the tileset at all seems impossible without exploiting some kind of memory overflow, which I'm just not going to do. Secondly, the tower mode has this tile switching. I believe that the code is just doing some kind of (usual tile number * a counter), and looping after the last colour (the bottom row in tiles3.png), probably using a modulo function. If I were to access tower mode at all, I first would have to turn on this tileset, which seems completely impossible. Second, I would somehow be needed to insert some kind of "map" to this tower, as it's read in a completely different way (I belive? I don't have access to the source soo..). And third, if the towers is hardcoded, i.e. the tower will only go X tiles before stopping, that would also stop me to use it properly.

The only tower you would be able to access with the current engine is Panic Room and The Final Challenge, as the polar dimension can be accessed easily from custom levels.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: ToasterApocalypse on June 10, 2012, 10:42:57 AM
The only tower you would be able to access with the current engine is Panic Room and The Final Challenge, as the polar dimension can be accessed easily from custom levels.

Wait, how is that possible?

More importantly, is it possible?
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on June 10, 2012, 10:59:05 AM
Um, yes, with finalmode(x,y).

finalmode(46,54)
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: LucasK on June 10, 2012, 01:01:03 PM
I still hope Terry release a version with auto-scrolling function.  :victoria:
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: ToasterApocalypse on June 13, 2012, 10:28:32 AM
I still hope Terry release a version with auto-scrolling function.  :victoria:

I think that was planned for 2.2 which won't be made.

Other question: How do I use the createcrewman command?
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on June 13, 2012, 10:46:29 AM
I don't know if Terry would like this but I guess that I can do some kind of documentation as many people ask questions about this.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: ToasterApocalypse on June 13, 2012, 10:52:10 AM
I don't know if Terry would like this but I guess that I can do some kind of documentation as many people ask questions about this.

Saves us messing up the thread, I suppose.  :P

Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on June 14, 2012, 07:08:42 AM
There you go
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: SaltyBarcode on June 14, 2012, 11:25:41 AM
Incredible idea, Incredible scripting. BUT WAY TOO HARD  :'(

Took about 5000 attempts on the arena, and literally rage-quitted after my 200th attempt at spike pit with a prize.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on June 14, 2012, 12:11:32 PM
Whoa, 5000 times :O

I'll nerf Platform Arena with the coming release, as most people found it too hard. Not so sure about Spike Pit (after all, it's a trinket challenge, and it was already nerfed) and Narrow Path.

I'll release a second beta with included fourth level soon ("Inversed Floors", bonus points for understanding what kind of challenge it has), and maybe include the real ending. That, or I'll just include the level and nerf.

I think the problem people has with making levels too hard is that they've probably succeed in the main game already, and make the challenges much harder due to that. Because, before, when I just won the game fully, w/all trinkets, etc, I still had problems with the featured levels, but they got easier by the time I play VVVVVV more.
I intended this to be easier, and tried to make it "too easy" for myself (I died 72 times on my first full play on this level, with all the trinkets), but maybe it wasn't enough?

Also, none complained about the spikes in the overworld, so I guess they're OK (I was afraid they would be frustrating).
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: Pyrite on June 15, 2012, 10:25:12 AM
That's some INSANE scripting power.
Whoa.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on June 15, 2012, 02:10:02 PM
Ok, second beta close to being finished!
Just going to fix two teleporter destinations that doesn't work at the moment.

Changelog:
* Nerfed Platform Arena
* Included fourth level (Inversed Floors)
* Included true ending (harder to achieve!)
* Now, the easter egg doesn't introduce glitches in various places (most, if not everyone of you, will most likely not find this out until someone does, and tell people in this thread! My only hint is that it's in the Platform Arena, and will reward you (you WILL know when you stumble upon it))

Things missing from the release:
* Two teleporters (have to figure out suitable positions for them)
* Maybe I need to balance more things

Other than that, the level is pretty much finished!
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on June 15, 2012, 02:53:59 PM
Back to VVVVVV second beta has been released.
Check the first post for the new update.

Please give feedback and bug reports!
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: blue626 on June 16, 2012, 12:19:20 PM
I read your document about scripts. How did you learn those?
Also, what glitches occur if you use those scripts?
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on June 16, 2012, 12:55:04 PM
I read your document about scripts. How did you learn those?
Also, what glitches occur if you use those scripts?
I opened up the binary in a text editor and found strings from the scripting of the real game (how Terry did the dialogs, mostly). If Terry didn't use it in an internal script, I don't know how it work, simple as that.

The only thing that this uses that I didn't found was the gamestate numbers (like for the gravitron, and the gamecomplete thingy), I had to bruteforce for these (testing gamestate 1, gamestate 2, 3, 4, ..., a list would be more practical but I can't really get that w/o the source).

Depending on how "well" (correct) you use them, you can do everything from getting it to work perfectly, throw in a small bug that forces you to restart VVVVVV, get VVVVVV to segfault (most common), get funny dialogs, or destroy your save.

Happy with that answer? :p

Also IMO it's better to take this to PM rather than messing up a thread that is about something else.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: Pyrite on June 16, 2012, 07:12:42 PM
This was pretty interesting with your "Game Completed!" thing. I can GUESS I'm better than SaltyBarcode in this, and I got all the trinkets EXCEPT! the ones in the tower-thing with enemy-spike narrow shaft falling.

:shiny: I am a trinket!
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on June 17, 2012, 11:01:04 AM
This was pretty interesting with your "Game Completed!" thing. I can GUESS I'm better than SaltyBarcode in this, and I got all the trinkets EXCEPT! the ones in the tower-thing with enemy-spike narrow shaft falling.

:shiny: I am a trinket!
Great! And thanks for the feedback.

Not a single one? Aww :p (Actually, in my buggy prerelease that I gave to a close friend, you *had* to go in chronological order for the trinkets in Dimension Tunnel, which I fixed after that). You haven't truly completed the level before all the trinkets. ;)
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on June 17, 2012, 11:13:33 AM
Ok, for some reason the PS in the polar dimension has decided to just not work at all post-"main" game (It worked for me the first time when I playtested, when releasing beta 2 D: ). I'll have to run tests and release a beta 2c with a fixed PS (If you're stuck due to this, wait until then).
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: SaltyBarcode on June 18, 2012, 06:25:28 AM
I can GUESS I'm better than SaltyBarcode in this

I CHALLENGE YOU TO A DUEL, SIR!
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on June 18, 2012, 07:14:42 AM
I fixed the PS!

Check the first post if you want to complete the level for real (99% of the times, you will fail to activate the PS in the polar dimension for a second time with beta 2b).

I also fixed stability issues regarding saving in places where you usually isn't able to, now you can escape if you saved in a "bad" place.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: Vallu on June 30, 2012, 04:46:48 PM
I checked the document and tried to do some of them... None worked. How did you, for an example teleport the player somewhere else? I also checked your level and after the beginning I was like: :o. Awesome scripting. I checked the level in level editor mode too and saw some scripts. After one script I was like: :o. Can you please tell me how did you teleport the player somewhere else with the flash effects? I'd like to know more about scripting since I'm going to make a lot levels... :victoria:
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on July 01, 2012, 06:19:26 AM
I checked the document and tried to do some of them... None worked. How did you, for an example teleport the player somewhere else? I also checked your level and after the beginning I was like: :o. Awesome scripting. I checked the level in level editor mode too and saw some scripts. After one script I was like: :o. Can you please tell me how did you teleport the player somewhere else with the flash effects? I'd like to know more about scripting since I'm going to make a lot levels... :victoria:
Hi.
This level uses an exploit which I found for some weeks ago that allows you to run internal scripting commands. I tricked the parser to not remove any scripting lines as it thought it would be part of say(). This way, I could execute internal scripting commands just like any other script in custom levels.
The trick was to use say() with a negative amount of lines. As the parser will not understand negative numbers, it belives that I just typed say(1) instead of say(-1). The internal conversion however, text(gray,0,0,-1) will do nothing at all, as it will do the same as if I've typed say(0), i.e. nothing will show up. So this way, I could get the parser to trust 1 line of internal code. Then, I used text(1,0,0,4) as the internal command to use. This is so I can override the next say command - say(5). This say() in turn, while in fact ignored, is thought by the parser to start a say() command. For this reason, I can in turn give 4 lines of internal code a time. The 5th line, I use for re-starting the parser trick (text(1,0,0,4) followed by say(5)). The reason for why I only do say(5) and reapply things all the time is to maintain 2.0 compatibility. Anything more than 5 will screw up the parser in VVVVVV 2.0.

Example:
Parser thinks that this:
say(-1)
text(1,0,0,4)
say(3)
endcutscene
untilbars
loadscript(stop)

will first spawn a gray dialog with the content "text(1,0,0,4)", then a dialig with:
endcutscene
untilbars
loadscript(stop)

In fact, the internal conversion will look like this (bold text is ignored):
cutscenebars
untilbars
squeak(terminal)
text(gray,0,0,-1) (do nothing!)
text(1,0,0,4)
customposition(center)
speak_active
squeak(terminal)
text(gray,0,0,3)

endcutscene
untilbars
loadscript(stop) (Here, the script is stopped, to prevent dialog rubbish)
customposition(center)
speak_active
endtext

Internal scripting commands are described in the document.

THIS IS SUBJECT OF BEING FIXED IN A STABLE 2.1. IN NO EVENT WILL I BE RESPONSIBLE FOR LEVELS BROKEN BY THIS, OTHER THAN LEVELS CREATED BY MYSELF
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: ToasterApocalypse on July 01, 2012, 07:37:33 AM
I checked the document and tried to do some of them... None worked. How did you, for an example teleport the player somewhere else? I also checked your level and after the beginning I was like: :o. Awesome scripting. I checked the level in level editor mode too and saw some scripts. After one script I was like: :o. Can you please tell me how did you teleport the player somewhere else with the flash effects? I'd like to know more about scripting since I'm going to make a lot levels... :victoria:
Hi.
This level uses an exploit which I found for some weeks ago that allows you to run internal scripting commands. I tricked the parser to not remove any scripting lines as it thought it would be part of say(). This way, I could execute internal scripting commands just like any other script in custom levels.
The trick was to use say() with a negative amount of lines. As the parser will not understand negative numbers, it belives that I just typed say(1) instead of say(-1). The internal conversion however, text(gray,0,0,-1) will do nothing at all, as it will do the same as if I've typed say(0), i.e. nothing will show up. So this way, I could get the parser to trust 1 line of internal code. Then, I used text(1,0,0,4) as the internal command to use. This is so I can override the next say command - say(5). This say() in turn, while in fact ignored, is thought by the parser to start a say() command. For this reason, I can in turn give 4 lines of internal code a time. The 5th line, I use for re-starting the parser trick (text(1,0,0,4) followed by say(5)). The reason for why I only do say(5) and reapply things all the time is to maintain 2.0 compatibility. Anything more than 5 will screw up the parser in VVVVVV 2.0.

Example:
Parser thinks that this:
say(-1)
text(1,0,0,4)
say(3)
endcutscene
untilbars
loadscript(stop)

will first spawn a gray dialog with the content "text(1,0,0,4)", then a dialig with:
endcutscene
untilbars
loadscript(stop)

In fact, the internal conversion will look like this (bold text is ignored):
cutscenebars
untilbars
squeak(terminal)
text(gray,0,0,-1) (do nothing!)
text(1,0,0,4)
customposition(center)
speak_active
squeak(terminal)
text(gray,0,0,3)

endcutscene
untilbars
loadscript(stop) (Here, the script is stopped, to prevent dialog rubbish)
customposition(center)
speak_active
endtext

Internal scripting commands are described in the document.

THIS IS SUBJECT OF BEING FIXED IN A STABLE 2.1. IN NO EVENT WILL I BE RESPONSIBLE FOR LEVELS BROKEN BY THIS, OTHER THAN LEVELS CREATED BY MYSELF

I opened up the .txt and input this script (Using the backgroundtext example with say)
Code: [Select]
say(-1)
text(blue,0,0,1)
Hi
backgroundtext
text(blue,0,20,1)
Bye
speak
endtext

and I got a blue text box at the top of the screen saying "customposition(center)"
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: ToasterApocalypse on July 08, 2012, 10:22:33 AM
I actually found out how to run internal commands and found a way to play as the crewmates!
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: blue626 on July 08, 2012, 11:21:10 AM
Actually, someone (PJBottomz) already found how to do that in v.2.0., using internal scripting. It is based on a code that someone else found to make colored text using 2.0. It can also make crewmates follow :viridian: (but, it only works with :vermillion:), as I said in the "Intermission 1 Recreation?" thread. Here's the link: VVVVVV's most POWERFUL Script? (http://distractionware.com/forum/index.php?topic=507.0)

However, you found a way to do it in v.2.1., didn't you? If so, that's new, even if it is similar. Besides, you didn't read the thread I mentioned, did you?
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on July 08, 2012, 02:48:17 PM
1) This level *use* an exploit that works in 2.1
2) You can get every crewmate, not just Vermillion. You're just not doing it right (try numbers instead of crewmate names/colors!)
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: blue626 on July 08, 2012, 04:41:27 PM
I hope that you understood that I was referring to what ToasterApocalipse said.
I didn't try to make crewmates follow :viridian:, I was just mentioning that someone already had discovered how to make that and change player color using 2.0 (as well as make colored text, play as "VVVVVVMan"...)

1) This level *use* an exploit that works in 2.1

Are you saying that in your level you used internal scripting to make crewmates follow :viridian:?
Also, I didn't write a comment about your level because I didn't download your level (yet). You said that v.2.1 is recommended because it's needed a map to find places, so, as I have 2.0., I didn't download it (yet).

We are off-topic, aren't we?
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: Blatch on July 11, 2012, 03:53:20 PM
Woah. For one thing, I don't want to break up the chatter in this thread, but I just came off playing part of this level for the first time, and there's nothing to really say other than the fact that I am amazed by what has managed to be done in this level. I've seen so many internal scripts used, that I think my head might implode if I see any more.

I've only played the first level; to be exact, it was the one with all of the gravity lines, using the Outside tileset. I really liked that section, although it did get a little iffy with the lack of checkpoints, especially in the section with the stationary spike platforms (though I did love the little joke made with the checkpoints in the upper part of the map, little things like that in a VVVVVV level always make me laugh).

I'll play a little more of the level very soon, but I am amazed at what FiQ managed to pull off here.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on October 08, 2012, 07:59:26 AM
I'm going to fix the ship terminals and release the final version of this level, hopefully without bugs!

Things to do not in the released version (spoilers ahead):
* Fix saving at The Gravitron (done)
* Fix last dialog before you "rescue" the crew member to end the level (done)
* Fix jukebox terminals and the teleporters only being usable 1 time and then you have to leave the room (done)
* Add the missing terminals from the ship, and a proper credits terminal (done)
* Fix the rushed credits dialog, actually call Souleye "Souleye", etc. (done)
* Fix so that if you enter Life Factory the second time, avoiding checkpoints and dying will continue to play Potential For Anything when you respawn in overworld (done)
* Remove music change to overworld music in the Life Factory "secret" trinket path because it feels wrong (done)
* Fix obvious internal script trigger when entering Whizz Down The Shaft "spawn point" when already in the dimension, as it isn't needed (done)
* Erase "The Ship" spawn point from the map until you complete the level for real (done)

And possible as a 1.1 if this level gets enough attention:
* Detect usage of version 2.0 to place a recommendation of using 2.1 due to it having a minimap
* Make progressive level complete dialog for 2.1 users
* Fix wrong music playing by saving at certain spots and then selecting the level again from menu. Even the main game has these bugs
* Rebalance Inversed Floors in case people find it too hard/easy (I didn't get very much feedback on this one)
* Possibly change the way the game ends to prevent you from having to rescue a crew member who isn't really missing, while keeping the "completion" mark that 2.1 introduced
* Tweak areas to make them look better (not SS though, as it's supposed to be pretty much original)
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: Dav999 on October 08, 2012, 08:09:28 AM
* Fix jukebox terminals only being usable 1 time and then you have to leave the room

If you haven't found out already: you can use gotoroom to do that, by just teleporting to the room you're in!
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on October 08, 2012, 08:11:24 AM
* Fix jukebox terminals only being usable 1 time and then you have to leave the room

If you haven't found out already: you can use gotoroom to do that, by just teleporting to the room you're in!
That was what I was going to do :P
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on October 08, 2012, 08:15:11 AM
I hope that you understood that I was referring to what ToasterApocalipse said.
I didn't try to make crewmates follow :viridian:, I was just mentioning that someone already had discovered how to make that and change player color using 2.0 (as well as make colored text, play as "VVVVVVMan"...)

1) This level *use* an exploit that works in 2.1

Are you saying that in your level you used internal scripting to make crewmates follow :viridian:?
Also, I didn't write a comment about your level because I didn't download your level (yet). You said that v.2.1 is recommended because it's needed a map to find places, so, as I have 2.0., I didn't download it (yet).
It isn't needed really, but it helps!
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: avengah on October 11, 2012, 06:31:43 AM
Just completed it, and the Super Gravitron doesn't work. No enemies appear. I didn't want to cheat the trophy; I'm assuming it would save my best time, so I'll pass, thanks. I want to earn it fairly. Apart from that, it's great! I thoroughly enjoyed it!
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on October 13, 2012, 02:01:41 AM
Just completed it, and the Super Gravitron doesn't work. No enemies appear. I didn't want to cheat the trophy; I'm assuming it would save my best time, so I'll pass, thanks. I want to earn it fairly. Apart from that, it's great! I thoroughly enjoyed it!
Thanks for the feedback! Yes, I'm aware of this bug. If you play one gravitron and then another one (i.e. first the normal Gravitron, then the super version), this happens. R (force respawn) should solve it. I'll look into a way of solving this bug.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: avengah on October 13, 2012, 10:11:40 AM
Sorry, I've just found another glitch. I loaded my save and it started me in the Gravitron on the ship, with only the lower line there. I'm stuck! I think this is because I saved on the ship after doing the Gravitron.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: Damn It AL to Hell on October 13, 2012, 10:58:28 AM
Cool level bro, It's a very decent story too! I give it 10/10

And that means.....

:shiny: _ :shiny:
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: avengah on October 13, 2012, 11:09:18 AM
Sorry, I got stuck again. There's a glitch in the DIY VI Repair room. I had 14 trinkets at that point (including THAT one, yes), and all that happened is it said "Hm" when I used the PS terminal, and nothing happened when I used the T7 terminal.

Ah, got it, looking through the script - it seems that the Polar Dimension PS script "trinketcheckbonus" is faulty. It fails to allow for the possibility of getting that bonus trinket before going to the Polar PS for the first time. An extra line in that script is needed: ifflag(39,diyvirepair)

I think, anyway. That looks like it might fix the problem. Otherwise, I think you have to wait until you've activated all power sources before going for the bonus trinket, maybe?

Spoiler: Oh, by the way, I cheated. Sorry! I noticed something in the scripts about 21 and I knew it was nothing to do with the one in the bonus area (that's unobtainable), so I found a bonus text string. I didn't know which area it was for, though, but I tried it in each area until I found it.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on October 13, 2012, 11:43:31 AM
Sorry, I got stuck again. There's a glitch in the DIY VI Repair room. I had 14 trinkets at that point (including THAT one, yes), and all that happened is it said "Hm" when I used the PS terminal, and nothing happened when I used the T7 terminal.

Ah, got it, looking through the script - it seems that the Polar Dimension PS script "trinketcheckbonus" is faulty. It fails to allow for the possibility of getting that bonus trinket before going to the Polar PS for the first time. An extra line in that script is needed: ifflag(39,diyvirepair)

I think, anyway. That looks like it might fix the problem. Otherwise, I think you have to wait until you've activated all power sources before going for the bonus trinket, maybe?

Spoiler: Oh, by the way, I cheated. Sorry! I noticed something in the scripts about 21 and I knew it was nothing to do with the one in the bonus area (that's unobtainable), so I found a bonus text string. I didn't know which area it was for, though, but I tried it in each area until I found it.
I know exactly what the problem is. The reason is that I use "iftrinketsless()", a faulty command that doesn't work as expected. Download the other .vvvvvv file and connect your save to it (That one isn't really stable and has a weird spawn location, but as long as you use your old save, things should work), that one has this bug fixed.

When I release the final version, all this DIY VI repair mess will be completly gone.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: blue626 on October 13, 2012, 12:14:03 PM
Don't forget that spoilers are white and quote boxes are blue! I didn't read everything...

I'm thinking of playing this level... when I have time.
What do you mean by connecting the save to it? Isn't the devbuild your level? (What do you mean bt devbuild, btw?)
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: avengah on October 13, 2012, 12:17:53 PM
There isn't an iftrinketsless command in that trinketcheckbonus script. All it does is say "Hm...", check one flag and check if you've got 21 trinkets - that's it. So, if that flag isn't set and you've got less than 21 trinkets, it just stops there.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: Dav999 on October 13, 2012, 12:18:42 PM
What do you mean by connecting the save to it? Isn't the devbuild your level? (What do you mean bt devbuild, btw?)

Making sure the name of the old save file is the same as the name of the new version!
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: avengah on October 13, 2012, 12:27:54 PM
It also does nothing (not even Hm...) if you've already been through the polar dimension and got less than 21 trinkets. However, this isn't fatal because you can still get out. Maybe that's where the iftrinketsless command was used? I haven't checked the scripts that much.

EDIT: It ALSO does nothing if you've GOT 21 trinkets! So you can't complete the game if you get that one extra!
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on October 13, 2012, 12:29:30 PM
There isn't an iftrinketsless command in that trinketcheckbonus script. All it does is say "Hm...", check one flag and check if you've got 21 trinkets - that's it. So, if that flag isn't set and you've got less than 21 trinkets, it just stops there.
Did you try the devbuild? It should solve your problem. If not, I'll have to look into it again...

In general, DIY VI Repair never worked as I wanted before I got rid of iftrinketsless() completly. The devbuild completly rewrote all the if checks, this time excluding the faulty command, so it should definitely work!

EDIT: Turns out that my proposed fix for making chained gravitrons not stop bullet spawning didn't work! Argh! As I don't really want to remove them, I'll throw in a disclaimer instead.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on October 13, 2012, 12:32:34 PM
Don't forget that spoilers are white and quote boxes are blue! I didn't read everything...

I'm thinking of playing this level... when I have time.
What do you mean by connecting the save to it? Isn't the devbuild your level? (What do you mean bt devbuild, btw?)
I name my levels that before releasing them to sort my backups. I just threw in the latest (not bug tested) version into this forum when I realized that DIY VI Repair still didn't work as intended, as that one rewrote that part to fix all the bugs.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on October 13, 2012, 01:03:19 PM
Sorry, I've just found another glitch. I loaded my save and it started me in the Gravitron on the ship, with only the lower line there. I'm stuck! I think this is because I saved on the ship after doing the Gravitron.
Yep, that's why.
It's fixed in the version I have locally, though!
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: blue626 on October 13, 2012, 01:07:03 PM
So, I can start playing your level from the "devbuild"? I already put it in the "VVVVVV" folder, I think... Is it supposed to be named "vvvvvv.vvvvvv"?
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on October 13, 2012, 01:18:59 PM
So, I can start playing your level from the "devbuild"? I already put it in the "VVVVVV" folder, I think... Is it supposed to be named "vvvvvv.vvvvvv"?
I think it has spawn point set wrong, that's why I only wanted people to use it if the beta 2c doesn't work.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: avengah on October 13, 2012, 01:47:57 PM
No, the spawn point is fine. I've just played through the whole thing.

May I make a suggestion? It'd be better if you remove the left warp line in "Remember Super Gravitron?" - it's possible to do it without using that line, and I did it the hard way the first time.

EDIT: This isn't a problem with your level, but it's a problem with VVVVVV. Finishing with 21 trinkets only gets you one star for completion. You have to finish with exactly 20 to get two stars. Shame really, but you have to complete it at least once with 20 to get that second star. I don't think there's a way to fix it unless you can set Trinkets to 20 at the exact point you collect the final crew member?
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on October 13, 2012, 02:29:47 PM
No, the spawn point is fine. I've just played through the whole thing.

May I make a suggestion? It'd be better if you remove the left warp line in "Remember Super Gravitron?" - it's possible to do it without using that line, and I did it the hard way the first time.

EDIT: This isn't a problem with your level, but it's a problem with VVVVVV. Finishing with 21 trinkets only gets you one star for completion. You have to finish with exactly 20 to get two stars. Shame really, but you have to complete it at least once with 20 to get that second star. I don't think there's a way to fix it unless you can set Trinkets to 20 at the exact point you collect the final crew member?
Yeah, that's a shame, I found that out when it was kind of too late...

Anyway, I *know* it's possible to that room the hard way, but I wanted to hint at another solution. I'll think about it :P

I've done everything I wanted before releasing 1.0 now. I'll playtest tomorrow and in case I don't find any bugs, I'll release it!

Fixes since beta 2.0c:
* DIY VI Repair works. For sure this time! Really! I hope so...
* Saving in gravitrons works
* There's now a disclaimer in the ship about gravitron chaining
* There isn't random terminals missing in the ship anymore
* There's a little monologue right before ending the level to "justify" rescuing Victoria
* You cannot get the wrong music playing without editing the save file manually now. Eheheh... (Also, this "bug" exists in the main game in some places :3)
* Proper credits info
* The ship map coordinates is hidden until the ending now. Also hides the teleporter hub before you go there by yourself
* Made a very minor nerf to Spike Pit
* There isn't any obvious internal script trigger in the polar dimension entry anymore
* Fixed possibility to die in the secret area due to Inversed Floors being right above it (this wasn't supposed to be possible)
* Ship jukebox semi-works. I've yet to find out exactly how to light terminals manually, but you should at least be able to trigger them more than once now.
* Fixed VVVVVV 2.0 bug related to music stopping (mostly seen in time trial in the original game) affecting two of my internal scripts.
* Fixed a less brutal respawn if you manage to die after doing the first part of the dimension story without hitting a checkpoint.
* The locator now acknowledges the lack of a map in VVVVVV 2.0. I can't really do more than saying that 2.1 is recommended there, though...
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on October 14, 2012, 08:42:36 AM
The stable version 1.0 has just been released! See the first post for changelog and download
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: Dav999 on October 14, 2012, 10:28:25 AM
All right! I played it again and I made a bug list:

Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on October 14, 2012, 10:51:31 AM
All right! I played it again and I made a bug list:
Thanks!

Press ENTER to activate terminal during the first cutscene
I'm aware of this, it wasn't exactly intended but it just became like this. I can move Viridian a bit at the start if it looks wrong!

Sometimes, during a cutscene with dialogues, the game just waits until you press enter, I guess there was supposed to be a text box there, but it didn't appear
This mostly happens on the first dialog (does it happen otherwise at all?) I cannot work-around this I believe. The "missing" dialogs are placeholders (there isn't any meaningful text there) as I was aware of it.

Some room names are different ('Chinese Room' should be called 'Chinese Rooms', 'Seeing Dollar $ign$' is actually called '$eeing Dollar $ign$', and 'The Hanged Man, Reverse' should be 'The Hanged Man, Reversed' but those are just small details)
Thanks, I'll fix them.

[grammar-nazi-mode]Some grammar mistakes (like Two Remains, One Remain, and 'Every source isn't on yet')[/grammar-nazi-mode]
English isn't my first language, what is correct @ "X remains"? I'll fix the latter.

You still can't use teleporter terminals to set the destination twice without leaving the room (same for the jukebox) ???
I only fixed one of the terminal "groups", I forgot the others. I will look into it!
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: Dav999 on October 14, 2012, 11:33:28 AM
[grammar-nazi-mode]Some grammar mistakes (like Two Remains, One Remain, and 'Every source isn't on yet')[/grammar-nazi-mode]
English isn't my first language, what is correct @ "X remains"? I'll fix the latter.

1 remains, 2 remain, 3 remain, etc.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: Dav999 on October 15, 2012, 03:41:47 AM
I have a suggestion. If you change the music with the jukebox, the music will switch back to Popular Potpurri after you use the materializer, or if you go back to that area. (where TD is, I don't know how that area is called) Maybe it's a good idea to use flags for that, if there are enough left?
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on October 15, 2012, 08:33:38 AM
I have a suggestion. If you change the music with the jukebox, the music will switch back to Popular Potpurri after you use the materializer, or if you go back to that area. (where TD is, I don't know how that area is called) Maybe it's a good idea to use flags for that, if there are enough left?
I did my best to use as little flags as possible, which led to very repetive scripts every now and then, just in case I needed more flags later. Currently there is 41 left that isn't reserved. (Also 21 flags that is reserved but not used, so there's plenty left). If I do this, this will cost 4+4 flags, so I'll end up with 33 flags left. Worth it? In terms of flags, sure! Whether I will actually do it is another question...

I thought of making the music stay actually but never did it. I might implement this :P

EDIT: Always fun when the script completly refuses to load my script properly but instead just stopping, and debugging doesn't give much at all!

EDIT: Oh please...
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on October 23, 2012, 01:37:08 PM
Couldn't get dynamic music to work because scripts for some reason just refuse to load properly.  :victoria:
In general, making new script calls in my level nowdays make really odd behaviour and usually doesn't work at all. Probably because I have pretty many scripts...

Oh well, I'll fix the rest of the things you reported and upload a new version!
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on October 31, 2012, 02:09:20 PM
Progress (I will do these things before releasing an update):
* Fixed grammatical errors in "PS activated!" text (done)
* Changed some internal scripts to use the "internal scripting w/o cutscenebars" method (done)
* Trinket room! Yay! (done)
* Jukebox terminals in secret area is reusable now (done)
* The secret area now remembers which music it played last (done)
* The jukebox at the end of the game will also remember what music it played last (done)
* Fixed "Press ACTION to activate terminal" at the beginning (done)
* Changed the background of the alternative path in Life Factory (done)
* You can't die in Secret Area anymore (by enemies from Platform Arena) (done)
* Terminals in Control Area that set destination is reusable now (done)
* Now there's an use for the leftmost terminal in Control Area (Not yet)
* Fixed a major bug letting you get infinite trinkets (done)
* Moved the terminals in the center "Control Area" to fix an occasional glitch (done)
* Made a trinket more interesting. As this resulted in moving a trinket, and due to how VVVVVV handles entities in custom levels, this WILL break saves (unless you collected all, or no, trinkets) (done)
* Made a place in overworld less frustrating (done)
* A last playthrough to debug everything (done)
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: avengah on November 07, 2012, 03:19:06 PM
I've encountered another couple of bugs, I'm afraid. Firstly, a minor bug - if you do Platform Arena third, go back without using a teleporter and then do the Smart People level fourth, you'll get the congratulatory message for the Smart People level, along with "One remains", and then you'll speak to Vita and Vitellary. If you then use any teleporter and come back, you'll get the congratulatory message for Platform Arena along with "One remains" again, Vita will still be there and you'll have the normal conversation with Vita (which is mostly the same as the conversation with Vita and Vitellary, except it automatically sends you to T1).

Now, the slightly more major bug. I did Plaform Arena third and Smart People fourth but didn't use an extra teleporter, thus skipping the congratulatory message for Platform Arena. After the Polar Dimension and secret area, I went back to TA and back through the Platform Arena again - and ended up with 22 trinkets. So for some reason the game allowed me to get the bonus trinket for a second time. I haven't looked at the scripts to determine a cause. I'll try a couple more things now.

Having 22 trinkets means two things - firstly you can skip one of the existing trinkets, and secondly your unlock file will say your highest number of collected trinkets will be 22. (In case anyone didn't know, collecting trinkets in a player level counts towards unlocking jukebox songs in the main game, as it saves the highest number you collect.)

EDIT: After a brief test, I seem to have found out that Life Factory makes the Platform Arena bonus trinket available again. I did Platform Arena first, then the Maze, then warped to TA and couldn't get it. Then I did Life Factory, warped to TA and did get it. I'll try a few more things. Maybe a flag is set in Life Factory that makes this trinket re-collectible?

EDIT 2: OK, the bonus trinket can be collected INFINITE times. Simply set the teleporter to T3, warp there ("There We Go!"), warp back, warp to TA and go back through Platform Arena. Every time you do this, you get an extra trinket.

EDIT 3: More fun. If you manage to get 21 trinkets before going to the Polar Dimension PS for the first time (get 19 before entering the Dimensional Tunnel), it skips the whole destabilising thing, and you end up back at the ship with a glitchy text box showing four lines of internal script, then the script stops leaving you on the ship. (Skipping the bit where you'd normally speak to your crew then go back to read a letter from Vita.) I'm also thinking that a side effect of the glitch may be that using T3 after collecting this trinket makes the game think you've not collected the bonus trinket, therefore it would only expect you to need 20, not 21 at the final PS. I've not confirmed that, though. A cursory look through the scripts makes me think this isn't the case, but I'm not sure. It's worth checking, though. I think the possible cause is that using T3 from Life Factory sets flag 99, which in turn allows you to get that bonus trinket since that's the flag checked when deciding whether to award it. I'm also assuming that the normal check inside the Platform Arena which decides whether to set flag 99 won't normally set it if you've already collected the trinket - but T3 sets flag 99 unconditionally.

Oh, and Tunnel T8 sets 99 too. I think you need to make sure that the trinket can still be collected if you don't get it straight away - let's say you come back later to Platform Arena, you should still be able to get it - but only once. So another flag might be required to ensure it's only collected once. And it's clear that Flag 99 is being used for two different things.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on November 08, 2012, 09:24:12 AM
Thank you for pointing out that I accidentally re-use flag 99.
From now on, teleporting to TA from the hub will now automatically turn flag 99 off.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: Dav999 on November 08, 2012, 09:35:10 AM
Thank you for pointing out that I accidentally re-use flag 99.
I'll switch the flag used for the bonus trinket, which will hopefully solve these problems.

I think everyone who makes a level with a lot of (internal) scripting should make a list with the used flags, and what they do, so they can easily see which flags were already used.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on November 08, 2012, 09:38:49 AM
Thank you for pointing out that I accidentally re-use flag 99.
I'll switch the flag used for the bonus trinket, which will hopefully solve these problems.

I think everyone who makes a level with a lot of (internal) scripting should make a list with the used flags, and what they do, so they can easily see which flags were already used.
I already do that, the issue is that flag 90-99 is listed as "temporary flags". They're used for many things. They're always turned off before being used to prevent this from happening, I just forgot to turn it off in this case.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: blue626 on November 09, 2012, 11:08:10 AM
Thank you for pointing out that I accidentally re-use flag 99.
I'll switch the flag used for the bonus trinket, which will hopefully solve these problems.

I think everyone who makes a level with a lot of (internal) scripting should make a list with the used flags, and what they do, so they can easily see which flags were already used.
I already do that, the issue is that flag 90-99 is listed as "temporary flags". They're used for many things. They're always turned off before being used to prevent this from happening, I just forgot to turn it off in this case.

If you use it, then check it. If you find another way of scripting that doesn't use that flag, then uncheck it. I don't see how listing temporary flags would help. ???

EDIT: Wait, I think I don't understand your post, as I confuse "uncheck" withn "turn off". Aren't flags alyways off before being used? I don't see why the other flags (0-89) would be on before they're used.. or I'm misunderstanding this (Note: I neither played the level nor looked into its scripts, but it's strange that flags are turned on before they're used).
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: avengah on November 09, 2012, 12:02:13 PM
So if you're going to make sure Flag 99 is off if you teleport to TA from the hub, does this mean that the bonus trinket MUST be collected at the first possible opportunity? There must be a better solution.

My solution would be to set a permanent flag upon collecting the bonus trinket, and check this flag before awarding this bonus trinket.

Incidentally, why do you end up with four lines of internal script in a visible text box if you collect 21 trinkets before going to the Polar Dimension PS for the first time? What causes the internal script to end up being displayed?

Oh yeah, don't forget about that thing where if you do Platform Arena third and Life Factory fourth, you'll see Vitellary and Vita together, then if you warp out and back in you'll see Vita again before being automatically sent to T1. I don't know whether this is because it saves the Platform Arena congratulatory message or not, but it could be part of the reason.

EDIT: Unfortunately I can only upload ZIP files. So anyway, here's a zip containing a picture of the glitch along with a save so you can trigger it yourself. Simply go up to the PS and use it. I've got 21 trinkets with the glitch, and this is my first visit to the Polar Dimension; I've skipped the whole destabilisation thing. I want to know why this text box appears!

Text:

customposition(center)
speak_active
squeak(terminal)
text(gray,0,114,4)

Ah. I think I've got it! The script "diyvirepair_done" has a customifflag(41,diyvirepair_done2) command, but if flag 41 isn't set then the script ends. Since it's still in internal scripting mode, those four commands (which aren't in any script in the game) are displayed as text due to the lack of a loadscript(stop) command, I think. Is that right?
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on November 09, 2012, 02:19:22 PM
It was meant to only be able to collect the first time anyway, so fixing the "infinite trinkets" bug is first priority. Then, I can look into alternative solutions which allows this opportunity more than 1 time.

The reason for weirdness if you have "too many" trinkets is due to how I check stuff at the last PS. While this shouldn't really be possible at all, it shouldn't cause a glitch like that. The reason it happens at all is that I made this script before people told me the obvious real solution for a loadscripter (i.e. using "iftrinkets(0,script)" instead of a flag) which I hadn't realized by myself. As flag 41 isn't set yet at that moment, which it really should be in normal cirumstances, things glitch.

About the vita vs vitellary+vita bug, I'll solve the problem by making teleporting after the bonus mandatory instead of just encouraged.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: Dav999 on November 09, 2012, 02:39:40 PM
If you don't want the game to say 21/20 trinkets, and give only one star, I think you can place a trinket in an inaccessible room with a text editor.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on November 09, 2012, 02:42:30 PM
If you don't want the game to say 21/20 trinkets, and give only one star, I think you can place a trinket in an inaccessible room with a text editor.
I'd like that bonus trinket to stay hidden until you stumble upon it for yourself, so the max is going to stay at 20 :)

It's a shame that it only gives one star though, nothing I can do about it.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: Dav999 on November 09, 2012, 02:53:48 PM
If you don't want the game to say 21/20 trinkets, and give only one star, I think you can place a trinket in an inaccessible room with a text editor.
I'd like that bonus trinket to stay hidden until you stumble upon it for yourself, so the max is going to stay at 20 :)

It's a shame that it only gives one star though, nothing I can do about it.

In that case, it isn't possible. Unless we find a way to exploit internal scripting to be able to use C++ commands in the script editor. :P Just like you can exploit simplified scripting to be able to use internal scripting in the script editor, maybe you can do the same in internal scripting? Who knows.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on November 09, 2012, 02:56:42 PM
If you don't want the game to say 21/20 trinkets, and give only one star, I think you can place a trinket in an inaccessible room with a text editor.
I'd like that bonus trinket to stay hidden until you stumble upon it for yourself, so the max is going to stay at 20 :)

It's a shame that it only gives one star though, nothing I can do about it.

In that case, it isn't possible. Unless we find a way to exploit internal scripting to be able to use C++ commands in the script editor. :P Just like you can exploit simplified scripting to be able to use internal scripting in the script editor, maybe you can do the same in internal scripting? Who knows.
C++ doesn't work like that, though.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: avengah on November 09, 2012, 04:22:51 PM
Yeah, I suggested before that the game should check if you've got more than 20 trinkets when you reach Victoria, and if so, set trinkets = 20. This would fix the one star instead of two problem. Unfortunately, it's not possible. Trinkets can't be set to 20, or any other number, as far as we know. Trinkets can be awarded (along with dialogue), but not taken away.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on November 09, 2012, 05:03:55 PM
Yeah, I suggested before that the game should check if you've got more than 20 trinkets when you reach Victoria, and if so, set trinkets = 20. This would fix the one star instead of two problem. Unfortunately, it's not possible. Trinkets can't be set to 20, or any other number, as far as we know. Trinkets can be awarded (along with dialogue), but not taken away.
Theoretically there's a solution -- by awarding 4294967295 trinkets.

That "solution" is however not really a good idea.. :P

EDIT to clarify: VVVVVV can execute ~200k commands per second (also depends on what you request it to do). Assuming this, it would take around 7 hours to give that many trinkets in the optimal way.

The solution I realized *would* be viable, if Terry actually decided to use the optimal data type for a trinket amount (8-bit integer) instead of a 32-bit one.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: avengah on November 09, 2012, 07:20:26 PM
Since trinkets are expressed in words, how would this work if you had that many of them? Or does it start using numbers after a certain point?

On another note, I may have found a solution to your Gravitron bug. This isn't thoroughly tested, so I can't guarantee success, but simply leave the room and return before attempting another Gravitron and you might find it loads properly. If this does work, then there are two ways you could implement it; one is to have the terminals say "The Gravitrons have temporarily overheated. Please come back later." You'd have a flag set when you use a Gravitron and clear it as soon as you enter the next room. The other solution would be to warp to the next room after finishing a gravitron, so you'd have to walk e.g. left to get back to the room with the Gravitron terminals. I repeat: I haven't thoroughly tested this so it may not work... but if it does, there will be no need for the warning message about chaining them.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: blue626 on November 10, 2012, 03:09:34 AM
Since trinkets are expressed in words, how would this work if you had that many of them? Or does it start using numbers after a certain point?

In the "Internal commands" thread, people said that if you get more than 50 trinkets or less than 0 trinkets (the last one only works if you edit the .vvvvvv file, obviously), it says "Lots out of twenty". Every # of trinkets >-1 and <51 it says the number in words.
(I understand why you didn't read the whole thread. It has too many replies!).

EDIT: Why would Terry give a 32-bit value for the # of trinkets anyway? Only Terry knows. From what people discovered (mentioned above), he knew from the start that he would need a maximum of 50 trinkets for the game. 8 bits are enough for that. Actually, 6 bits are enough for that and 5 bits are enough for 20, but apparently you can only set a # to have 2x bits, possibly because x bits make 2x numbers... I don't know much about programming.
What would happen when you give the 232th trinket, anyway? Wouldn't VVVVVV crash, like when using play(16) because x in play(x) has 4 bits and 24=16?

EDIT 2: I don't see how can FIQ's solution be a solution even if it wouldn't take 7 hours. The number he mentioned is 232-1, that is equal to all 32 bits being 1. Would that cause anything besides saying "Lots out of Twenty"?
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on November 10, 2012, 04:19:23 AM
Since trinkets are expressed in words, how would this work if you had that many of them? Or does it start using numbers after a certain point?

In the "Internal commands" thread, people said that if you get more than 50 trinkets or less than 0 trinkets (the last one only works if you edit the .vvvvvv file, obviously), it says "Lots out of twenty". Every # of trinkets >-1 and <51 it says the number in words.
(I understand why you didn't read the whole thread. It has too many replies!).

EDIT: Why would Terry give a 32-bit value for the # of trinkets anyway? Only Terry knows. From what people discovered (mentioned above), he knew from the start that he would need a maximum of 50 trinkets for the game. 8 bits are enough for that. Actually, 6 bits are enough for that and 5 bits are enough for 20, but apparently you can only set a # to have 2x bits, possibly because x bits make 2x numbers... I don't know much about programming.
What would happen when you give the 232th trinket, anyway? Wouldn't VVVVVV crash, like when using play(16) because x in play(x) has 4 bits and 24=16?

EDIT 2: I don't see how can FIQ's solution be a solution even if it wouldn't take 7 hours. The number he mentioned is 232-1, that is equal to all 32 bits being 1. Would that cause anything besides saying "Lots out of Twenty"?
Trinket amount wrap around 4294967296 trinkets, so if you award 232-1, you will end up with 1 less trinket than you began with (i.e. 20).

EDIT: Yes, it should crash, but strangely this didn't happen in this case (I tried to set trinket amount to 4294967297 and ended up with 1 trinket due to the wrapping)

EDIT2: There's a bug in 2.1 in custom levels regarding the maps that occasionally exposes all of the 10th column (The Tower in the normal game). Occasionally, this also happens in my level -- but the column happens to be the dimensional tunnel, and is only exposed when *in* it. How fitting :P
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on November 10, 2012, 06:12:46 AM
Version 1.1 has been released!
Download it from the first post.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: avengah on November 10, 2012, 08:35:51 AM
I haven't downloaded it yet, but I was going to say an easy way to fix the repeating bonus trinket bug would be to simply add one line to the achievementcheck script.

Before:

ifflag(99,achievementcheck2)

After:

ifflag(46,stop)
ifflag(99,achievementcheck2)

Flag 46 is set when you get the bonus trinket. There, it doesn't repeat!

As for forcing the player to teleport after getting the bonus, this can be done by using internal scripting to move the player to TB and teleport to the hub after getting the bonus trinket, I think.

EDIT: Playing V1.1 now, and it still says "Press ENTER to activate terminal".

EDIT 2: Small graphical glitch on the left edge of Very Good, Here's A Trinket. Finally, when you reach the ending and read Vita's note, you want to set the checkpoint there. I pressed R and ended up back at the Polar Dimension PS.

Oh, and it seems I was wrong about going to the next room before doing another Gravitron. Sorry about that...
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on November 10, 2012, 05:28:53 PM
EDIT: Playing V1.1 now, and it still says "Press ENTER to activate terminal".
Huh?
I just opened Back to VVVVVV 1.1 and it doesn't show something like that...
I also tried in 2.0, still no text like that.

What did it say the version was when you opened the level?
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: avengah on November 10, 2012, 05:58:52 PM
V1.1. It's definitely updated, as you're automatically teleported after the bonus trinket. Anyway, at the start, I move slightly right to talk to Vermilion, then left to talk to Vita but not very far - only about half a square, so I'm still next to the terminal. I'll try again... Yeah, the same result.

I think the same happens after you get the "One remains" message - you're in front of T0 so you get the Press ENTER message.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on November 11, 2012, 05:46:29 AM
V1.1. It's definitely updated, as you're automatically teleported after the bonus trinket. Anyway, at the start, I move slightly right to talk to Vermilion, then left to talk to Vita but not very far - only about half a square, so I'm still next to the terminal. I'll try again... Yeah, the same result.

I think the same happens after you get the "One remains" message - you're in front of T0 so you get the Press ENTER message.
Oh, *that* terminal. I was thinking on the terminal at the start of the level (when at the ship)!

I'll not be able to solve this without doing heavy modifications to that room, so I'll think about it.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: blue626 on November 12, 2012, 01:18:53 PM
Since trinkets are expressed in words, how would this work if you had that many of them? Or does it start using numbers after a certain point?

(off-topic text)

EDIT 2: I don't see how can FIQ's solution be a solution even if it wouldn't take 7 hours. The number he mentioned is 232-1, that is equal to all 32 bits being 1. Would that cause anything besides saying "Lots out of Twenty"?
Trinket amount wrap around 4294967296 trinkets, so if you award 232-1, you will end up with 1 less trinket than you began with (i.e. 20).

I guess I misunderstood... I forgot that you would already have 20 trinkets before doing that.

Since trinkets are expressed in words, how would this work if you had that many of them? Or does it start using numbers after a certain point?

(off-topic text)

What would happen when you give the 232th trinket, anyway? Wouldn't VVVVVV crash, like when using play(16) because x in play(x) has 4 bits and 24=16?

(unrelated text)
EDIT: Yes, it should crash, but strangely this didn't happen in this case (I tried to set trinket amount to 4294967297 and ended up with 1 trinket due to the wrapping)

The wrapping is weird. Did you wait 7 hours to test that!? :o

On-topic: Note: I'm using VVVVVV 2.0 and I was playing v.1.1 of your level.
I played part of your level, and I noticed that some of :viridian:'s dialog when already in Dimension VVVVVV is grey. IIRC, :viridian:'s dialog while still on the ship was cyan, and all the other dialogs are the right color.

Everything in Dimension VVVVVV that wasn't destroyed or modified seemed equal as in the main game! :o

In the puzzle/maze area, you don't need to check the amp to see if you warped around or not (Actually, using 2.0., it's impossible for me). You can either check if the CP stayed lit or not, or check if :viridian: is split into 2 parts while on the edge of the screen.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on November 12, 2012, 01:52:44 PM
Since trinkets are expressed in words, how would this work if you had that many of them? Or does it start using numbers after a certain point?

(off-topic text)

EDIT 2: I don't see how can FIQ's solution be a solution even if it wouldn't take 7 hours. The number he mentioned is 232-1, that is equal to all 32 bits being 1. Would that cause anything besides saying "Lots out of Twenty"?
Trinket amount wrap around 4294967296 trinkets, so if you award 232-1, you will end up with 1 less trinket than you began with (i.e. 20).

I guess I misunderstood... I forgot that you would already have 20 trinkets before doing that.

Since trinkets are expressed in words, how would this work if you had that many of them? Or does it start using numbers after a certain point?

(off-topic text)

What would happen when you give the 232th trinket, anyway? Wouldn't VVVVVV crash, like when using play(16) because x in play(x) has 4 bits and 24=16?

(unrelated text)
EDIT: Yes, it should crash, but strangely this didn't happen in this case (I tried to set trinket amount to 4294967297 and ended up with 1 trinket due to the wrapping)

The wrapping is weird. Did you wait 7 hours to test that!? :o

On-topic: Note: I'm using VVVVVV 2.0 and I was playing v.1.1 of your level.
I played part of your level, and I noticed that some of :viridian:'s dialog when already in Dimension VVVVVV is grey. IIRC, :viridian:'s dialog while still on the ship was cyan, and all the other dialogs are the right color.

Everything in Dimension VVVVVV that wasn't destroyed or modified seemed equal as in the main game! :o

In the puzzle/maze area, you don't need to check the amp to see if you warped around or not (Actually, using 2.0., it's impossible for me). You can either check if the CP stayed lit or not, or check if :viridian: is split into 2 parts while on the edge of the screen.
I playtested the level on 2.0, Viridian's dialog should stay the same color no matter the version.

Yeah, I know you don't need to use the map, but it might help. The reason that there's checkpoints at all is for 2.0 users.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: Hilbert on November 12, 2012, 04:42:02 PM
If you go above 50, it will say 'Lots out of Twenty'. Same with under zero. Try it with -80819827812703287798147987108724897248978493. :P
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: Dav999 on November 12, 2012, 10:34:08 PM
If you go above 50, it will say 'Lots out of Twenty'. Same with under zero. Try it with -80819827812703287798147987108724897248978493. :P

I believe that will wrap around a lot, and you may just end up between 0 and 50 again. :P
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: blue626 on November 13, 2012, 11:23:49 AM
On-topic: Note: I'm using VVVVVV 2.0 and I was playing v.1.1 of your level.
I played part of your level, and I noticed that some of :viridian:'s dialog when already in Dimension VVVVVV is grey. IIRC, :viridian:'s dialog while still on the ship was cyan, and all the other dialogs are the right color.
I playtested the level on 2.0, Viridian's dialog should stay the same color no matter the version.

I rememeber part of :viridian:'s dialog not being cyan, but sort of grey... is there any chance that color I saw was a mix between cyan and grey?

The floor in "Getting here is just half of the fun" is hidden inside the room name. Was that intended?

I didn't complete the level yet, but is there a story-related reason for using terminals instead of warp tokens (if the reason is part of the story then write it inside abbr)?

Did anyone see a reference of a famous videogame in the level? I liked it. :viridian:

If you go above 50, it will say 'Lots out of Twenty'. Same with under zero. Try it with -80819827812703287798147987108724897248978493. :P

Who were you replying to? To avengah?

Since trinkets are expressed in words, how would this work if you had that many of them? Or does it start using numbers after a certain point?

If so, read all the replies after that.

...I just realized something from Dav999's post, but I'll write it in the "Internal commands" thread since it's off-topic.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on November 13, 2012, 02:31:36 PM
Can you print the dialog you're referring to please?

Hiding the floor in the DTTHW room was indeed intended.

Warp tokens give me less power and then I had to do the hub much larger. That's why I used terminals.

I play the game I referenced occasionally, it's a favorite game of a friend :P
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: avengah on November 14, 2012, 03:46:26 PM
Small glitch. If Vitellary is in the teleport room when you use T1-6, he vanishes instantly, but you still get the message about him not waiting when you go to a side room. I assume Vita would also disappear instantly. I think you need to make it so that if Vitellary is there, or both of them, that they're regenerated when you reload the room. I don't think you need to worry about Vita solo, since you're not given control when he's there on his own.

EDIT: "Walk Agsint The Flow"? And "victoria" in the final dialogue?
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on November 15, 2012, 05:57:09 AM
Small glitch. If Vitellary is in the teleport room when you use T1-6, he vanishes instantly, but you still get the message about him not waiting when you go to a side room. I assume Vita would also disappear instantly. I think you need to make it so that if Vitellary is there, or both of them, that they're regenerated when you reload the room. I don't think you need to worry about Vita solo, since you're not given control when he's there on his own.

EDIT: "Walk Agsint The Flow"? And "victoria" in the final dialogue?
Thank you for stating these bugs. I'll try to fix them.
And yeah, there's small grammar/spelling issues here and there, English isn't my main language.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: blue626 on November 16, 2012, 12:24:02 PM
Can you print the dialog you're referring to please?

The 1st grey text box said something like:

"Wait... is this dimension called... Dimension VVVVVV?"

Every :viridian: text box in the dialog in the hub after that was grey. Note, that, while, being grey, they were positioned over :viridian:.

Off-topic:

I play the game I referenced occasionally, it's a favorite game of a friend :P

I used to play it too! The last time was some moths ago.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: blue626 on November 26, 2012, 01:24:39 PM
Small bump!

Continued to play. Completed "Inversed Floors" and "Platform Arena" and found 9 trinkets overall so far.
I don't seem to find anything else, yet it says there are 3 more PS to find (as well as 11 trinkets). I checked the modified SS2 and found nothing. Is the zone next to T2 unlocked already, I don't remember if I checked... Is there something in the maze I didn't find?
Bugs:
After leaving Platform Arena, there is a flip sound instead of a "Level Complete" sound like in Inveresed Floors.
You can activate the script in "Getting here is just half of the fun" while touching spikes, making a text box appear at the top saying "Press ACTION to continue". It disappears if you press up (or down) or Enter.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on November 27, 2012, 08:49:30 AM
Small bump!

Continued to play. Completed "Inversed Floors" and "Platform Arena" and found 9 trinkets overall so far.
I don't seem to find anything else, yet it says there are 3 more PS to find (as well as 11 trinkets). I checked the modified SS2 and found nothing. Is the zone next to T2 unlocked already, I don't remember if I checked... Is there something in the maze I didn't find?
Bugs:
After leaving Platform Arena, there is a flip sound instead of a "Level Complete" sound like in Inveresed Floors.
You can activate the script in "Getting here is just half of the fun" while touching spikes, making a text box appear at the top saying "Press ACTION to continue". It disappears if you press up (or down) or Enter.
The platform arena sound issue: Can you tell exactly which power sources you activated before clearing the level, or none if you didn't find any before?
Go and explore the maze more :)
Also, assuming you use 2.1, you should have a map. Try to go to unexplored locations and you'll find... well, unexplored things! :)

And no, the location east of T2 isn't open yet in your progress.

The bug you're describing is kind of hard to fix to be honest. I can make a terminal there instead, but then...
* it will be obvious that it's closed
* you can still trigger the bug if you flip and activate it the same time (This also happens in the main game in this place).
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: blue626 on November 27, 2012, 11:50:54 AM
I completed Inversion floors before that (and, thus, I activated its PS).

I was already planning to explore the maze more, but thanks for the hint! I only found 2 trinkets there, no PSs. ... Is it okay that everyone knows that there's other things besides 2 trinkets in the maze (because we wrote it here)?

No, I use 2.0. I'll try to explore everything. The fact that the level is simply a modified Dim. VVVVVV helps!

It's better to leave it like that, then. It's just a minor glitch.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on November 27, 2012, 12:19:50 PM
Current changelog for an eventual 1.2 if I feel it's worth it:
* Fixed clearing Platform Arena playing a flip sound effect instead of the level complete song in some cirumstances
* Fixed using TD resulting in "Level part completed! @ Life Factory" dialog if you had Potential for Anything activated in jukebox
* Altered the terminal in Crossway to give a more useful hint for 2.0 users.
* Made trinket locator usable for 2.0 users
* Made a room right of the trinket locator which you can use to check which trinkets you've found and which you miss currently
* Made the terminal in Crossway usable for 2.0 users
* Made a trinket room available before the end
* Made a TF pointing to the second dimensional tunnel (disabled before you complete the first phase of the level)
* Created a visible divot in Teleporter Divot
* Made *all* rooms in Dimensional Tunnel "wrap", there used to be a few rooms which didn't.
* Fixed a bug in which Vitellary (and possibly Vita) would disappear when choosing teleporter destination.
* Cheat code system. Codes are listed at the ship.
* Altered Into The Platform Arena slightly.
* Buffed Flip Training
* Nerfed Better Safe Than Sorry, Right?
* Fixed a typo in a roomname (Walk Agsint The Flow -> Walk Against The Flow)
* Placed checkpoints in DT (polar -> VVVVVV) at the trinket paths to make you walk less
* Placed several new checkpoints in the overworld to prevent dying in the few spots you can die at taking you to somewhere else far away
* Made a terminal at DT before the trinkets which comments a little on them, just for fun
* Made several script optimizations to account for hard limit of 500 scripts per level
* Fixed several typos
* Fixed a bug in the initial cutscene that made text boxes not show up correctly, and then crash VVVVVV if you button mash ACTION
* Removed an enemy in Easier Than it Looks to prevent dying by sheer (un)luck (this isn't a nerf in practice)
* Added persistent Vermilion at the ship, explaining the gravitron terminals.
* Added a 22nd trinket challenge -- complete the game (activate polar PS with 20 trinkets) and only ever activate destination teleporters in the hub personally 2 times
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: blue626 on December 08, 2012, 06:26:04 AM
I continued playing and found the PS in the Maze.
After that, I continued exploring and noticed that I forgot to explore a part of the over-world and found the 4th area.
I collected 3 trinkets in there. I believe the hardest room was... I don't remember the name, but it had 4 block enemies moving vertically in a narrow hallway. They moved without synchronization (like a wave), so it was hard. The 2nd was the room after "Not Really". I collected the "Spike Pit with a Prize" trinket with only 2/3 deaths and the one at the beginning with only 1 death (this was supposed to be easy, wasn't it?).
Also, was the trinket next to T2 (that I already got before activating the PS in the maze) supposed to have an easy method to get it? You can (hover), but I assume it  can be done in the hard way too.
After activating the 4th PS and returned to the hub, I noticed that the dialog had grammatical error... I don't remember where, but Vita said "was" when it was suppose to be "were".
I went through the Dimensional Tunnel and to the Polar Dimension. Was the Gravitron (or whatever was in the place of the Gravitron) optional? Did it have a trinket? Anyway, I took the warp token in "Whee Sports", skipping it.
Then I played the Final Level until "Right". I did try "Walk Against the flow", but it was hard. Also, "Walk against the flow" isn't spelt correctly.
Currently with 13 trinkets.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on December 08, 2012, 09:01:53 AM
I continued playing and found the PS in the Maze.
After that, I continued exploring and noticed that I forgot to explore a part of the over-world and found the 4th area.
I collected 3 trinkets in there. I believe the hardest room was... I don't remember the name, but it had 4 block enemies moving vertically in a narrow hallway. They moved without synchronization (like a wave), so it was hard. The 2nd was the room after "Not Really". I collected the "Spike Pit with a Prize" trinket with only 2/3 deaths and the one at the beginning with only 1 death (this was supposed to be easy, wasn't it?).
Also, was the trinket next to T2 (that I already got before activating the PS in the maze) supposed to have an easy method to get it? You can (hover), but I assume it  can be done in the hard way too.
After activating the 4th PS and returned to the hub, I noticed that the dialog had grammatical error... I don't remember where, but Vita said "was" when it was suppose to be "were".
I went through the Dimensional Tunnel and to the Polar Dimension. Was the Gravitron (or whatever was in the place of the Gravitron) optional? Did it have a trinket? Anyway, I took the warp token in "Whee Sports", skipping it.
Then I played the Final Level until "Right". I did try "Walk Against the flow", but it was hard. Also, "Walk against the flow" isn't spelt correctly.
Currently with 13 trinkets.
Personally I found walk against the flow to be pretty easy, but that might just be me. :P

Also, "You Thought It Was Easy?" was way too hard in the fragment, and required frustratingly exact timing. I fixed this, making the challenge easy for real in the process.

The pre-gravitron plus gravitron part of the polar dimension is unchanged (except for the warp token), but after the gravitron you get a trinket.

The easy solution at the place left of T2 is intended. However, you'll have to do it the hard way to EXIT from there ;)
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: blue626 on December 12, 2012, 09:29:19 AM
Actually I only needed 30-40 deaths to complete Walk Against the flow, so it isn't as hard as I thought, but it was hard.
I completed the Final Level and the other part of the DT. I noticed you put an ending similar to one in VVVVVV after teleporting in T4, with scores! Completed the "game" with ≈650 deaths. 61 deaths in the room with most deaths, though it didn't show which room was due to a bug in 2.0. that was probably fixed in 2.1. beta.
In the dialog after that, I'm sure that some of Viridian's dialog was grey, but above him.
Is T7 (in the hub) supposed to say "Access Denied!" even if I completed the Final Level? And was the T7 next to the PS the Polar Dimension do nothing beofre the Final Level? IIRC, TC (in Inversion Floors) said "This doesn't work yet." or something if I didn't activate the PS yet.
The "Strong Security" (or whatever it was named) trinket seemed random... or maybe I didn't "see" the trick. Anyway, I got because of luck.
The trinkets in the DT are harder (not random, though). I tried getting the 1st one and after ≈50 deaths I still didn't get it. Made a quick-save in there and quit.
Died ≈770 times and currently have 17 trinkets. I'm going to try to get all 20 of them, as I didn't really complete the level.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: ToasterApocalypse on December 12, 2012, 10:26:09 AM
As of posting this, I have around 700 deaths and 19 trinkets. I'm trying to find the last one!

:viridian: WHERE ARE YOU TRINKET?                                     :shiny: umad?
                                                                                   
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: blue626 on December 12, 2012, 10:35:17 AM
As of posting this, I have around 700 deaths and 19 trinkets. I'm trying to find the last one!

:viridian: WHERE ARE YOU TRINKET?                                     :shiny: umad?
                                                                                 

Really? I guess It's going to be hard for me too. I already didn't knew the exact location of the 20th trinket (having 17 trinkets and knowing that 2 are in the DT). However I thought it might have been some that I skipped. I'm going to explore all the zones and the over-world. Still, you have 2.1 beta... (hover). I have 2.0. so you should find it easier than me.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: ToasterApocalypse on December 12, 2012, 10:43:48 AM
As of posting this, I have around 700 deaths and 19 trinkets. I'm trying to find the last one!

:viridian: WHERE ARE YOU TRINKET?                                     :shiny: umad?
                                                                                 

Really? I guess It's going to be hard for me too. I already didn't knew the exact location of the 20th trinket (having 17 trinkets and knowing that 2 are in the DT). However I thought it might have been some that I skipped. I'm going to explore all the zones and the over-world. Still, you have 2.1 beta... (hover). I have 2.0. so you should find it easier than me.

I just did! You have to activate the TE terminal to go under the station, do the little obstacle and boom trinket.

That was a very nice ending. I liked it!
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on December 12, 2012, 01:51:55 PM
As of posting this, I have around 700 deaths and 19 trinkets. I'm trying to find the last one!

:viridian: WHERE ARE YOU TRINKET?                                     :shiny: umad?
                                                                                 

Really? I guess It's going to be hard for me too. I already didn't knew the exact location of the 20th trinket (having 17 trinkets and knowing that 2 are in the DT). However I thought it might have been some that I skipped. I'm going to explore all the zones and the over-world. Still, you have 2.1 beta... (hover). I have 2.0. so you should find it easier than me.

I just did! You have to activate the TE terminal to go under the station, do the little obstacle and boom trinket.

That was a very nice ending. I liked it!
The trinket was at another place earlier, but I really liked to do this little challenge. :)
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: ToasterApocalypse on December 12, 2012, 01:54:38 PM
As of posting this, I have around 700 deaths and 19 trinkets. I'm trying to find the last one!

:viridian: WHERE ARE YOU TRINKET?                                     :shiny: umad?
                                                                                 

Really? I guess It's going to be hard for me too. I already didn't knew the exact location of the 20th trinket (having 17 trinkets and knowing that 2 are in the DT). However I thought it might have been some that I skipped. I'm going to explore all the zones and the over-world. Still, you have 2.1 beta... (hover). I have 2.0. so you should find it easier than me.

I just did! You have to activate the TE terminal to go under the station, do the little obstacle and boom trinket.

That was a very nice ending. I liked it!
The trinket was at another place earlier, but I really liked to do this little challenge. :)

The real challenge, for me, was finding out where it was!  >:(
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on December 12, 2012, 01:59:20 PM
As of posting this, I have around 700 deaths and 19 trinkets. I'm trying to find the last one!

:viridian: WHERE ARE YOU TRINKET?                                     :shiny: umad?
                                                                                 

Really? I guess It's going to be hard for me too. I already didn't knew the exact location of the 20th trinket (having 17 trinkets and knowing that 2 are in the DT). However I thought it might have been some that I skipped. I'm going to explore all the zones and the over-world. Still, you have 2.1 beta... (hover). I have 2.0. so you should find it easier than me.

I just did! You have to activate the TE terminal to go under the station, do the little obstacle and boom trinket.

That was a very nice ending. I liked it!
The trinket was at another place earlier, but I really liked to do this little challenge. :)

The real challenge, for me, was finding out where it was!  >:(
Don't you have 2.1? As vita & co. tells when they open access to  Secret Area, there's a trinket lokator inside, straight down. With included instructions on usage.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: blue626 on December 13, 2012, 10:23:44 AM
Exactly as I said in the abbr!
Still, I think it helps 2.0. players too, but it's still harder... (hover)

(Oh, and may I remind that quote boxes are blue and those spoilers are white? Another reason to use abbr tags!)
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: Dav999 on December 13, 2012, 11:08:12 AM
Exactly as I said in the abbr!
Still, I think it helps 2.0. players too, but it's still harder... (hover)

(Oh, and may I remind that quote boxes are blue and those spoilers are white? Another reason to use abbr tags!)

My iPod doesn't have a mouse. So I can't hover over text! I have to quote a post in order to see things inside abbr. Another reason not to use abbr tags!
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: blue626 on December 13, 2012, 11:53:27 AM
Exactly as I said in the abbr!
Still, I think it helps 2.0. players too, but it's still harder... (hover)

(Oh, and may I remind that quote boxes are blue and those spoilers are white? Another reason to use abbr tags!)

My iPod doesn't have a mouse. So I can't hover over text! I have to quote a post in order to see things inside abbr. Another reason not to use abbr tags!

I have an iPad, and I can't highlight white text there either for some reason. Try hightlighting this on your iPod (or iPhone or iPad): Can you read this?
...However, I believe that zooming in and looking carefully, you can read white text without highlighting (and you can do that on your computer too), except if it's in the background color. But why can't you highlight white text in there? Anyway it's harder to read spoilers on iPod. You just made me think about using abbr or not.

(We shouldn't get off-topic for much time)
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: Dav999 on December 13, 2012, 12:20:01 PM
I have an iPad, and I can't highlight white text there either for some reason. Try hightlighting this on your iPod (or iPhone or iPad): Can you read this?

I can read that just fine, but I know what you mean. If you select things on an iOS device, the text color isn't changed to a different color than the background, if the text and background colors are the same.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: blue626 on December 18, 2012, 08:57:40 AM
I tried getting the trinkets in the DT.
I got the 1st one, but the 2nd is very hard. Specially the 3rd room. It's already very hard to pass around the 3rd enemy (Died ≈100 times before doing it, but then I could do it frequently), and I couldn't pass the 4th one (but I think I can do it). I realized later that, that the 4th room is easy and it's the last one, so I'll try to get it.
After I gave up, searched a bit, looked at the map and realized that the 20th was also in the DT.
Actually, once I started exploring the space below the Space Station, I realized how to get the trinket Toaster mentioned, and got it after I completed Inversion Floors (I think?). It was my 7th trinket (or around that).
I suppose the 20th trinket is even harder than the 19th? The 19th is already very hard, and I'm only going to spend more 45 min. in this, so I doubt that I'll finish this level.
Why, in the DT, there are 2 warp tokens in the end of each fall? Same in one of the rooms with T7. I also don't see the purpose of the 3 separate room at the ned of the DT. Are they just a small challenge if you're exiting the DT?
1225 deaths in total, so I died more ≈450 times. ≈75 of them were getting the 18th trinket, ≈50 were exiting and entering the DT, the remaining were trying to get the 19th.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on December 18, 2012, 11:15:35 AM
I tried getting the trinkets in the DT.
I got the 1st one, but the 2nd is very hard. Specially the 3rd room. It's already very hard to pass around the 3rd enemy (Died ≈100 times before doing it, but then I could do it frequently), and I couldn't pass the 4th one (but I think I can do it). I realized later that, that the 4th room is easy and it's the last one, so I'll try to get it.
After I gave up, searched a bit, looked at the map and realized that the 20th was also in the DT.
Actually, once I started exploring the space below the Space Station, I realized how to get the trinket Toaster mentioned, and got it after I completed Inversion Floors (I think?). It was my 7th trinket (or around that).
I suppose the 20th trinket is even harder than the 19th? The 19th is already very hard, and I'm only going to spend more 45 min. in this, so I doubt that I'll finish this level.
Why, in the DT, there are 2 warp tokens in the end of each fall? Same in one of the rooms with T7. I also don't see the purpose of the 3 separate room at the ned of the DT. Are they just a small challenge if you're exiting the DT?
1225 deaths in total, so I died more ≈450 times. ≈75 of them were getting the 18th trinket, ≈50 were exiting and entering the DT, the remaining were trying to get the 19th.
The 3rd trinket @dt is easier than the 2nd one. Also, I can do a slight change with the 2nd trinket if people find it too frustrating (hard is OK, frustrating is bad).

2 warp tokens is mostly to make warping mandatory once you approach the bottom. The reason this is true for the polar dimension entrance of DT as well is to give a slightly familiar feeling and a hint on what's waiting.

The 3 rooms at the end is for 2 reasons: to get the feeling of reaching the end (there are warps before the 3 last rooms), and to give a last challenge before the end of the first part of the level on the way back to VVVVVV (activating every PS).
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: blue626 on December 19, 2012, 07:30:21 AM
The 3rd trinket @dt is easier than the 2nd one. Also, I can do a slight change with the 2nd trinket if people find it too frustrating (hard is OK, frustrating is bad).

It's very hard. However, I don't think it's very annoying, so it's not frustrating.
The 3rd is easier than the 2nd? That's strange... or did you originally wanted the 3rd to be harder and didn't want to change? I didn't try the 3rd yet.
I'll try getting those 2 trinkets some hours later. After that, I might as well give a rating to this level... I only did that twice so far, but yes.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on December 19, 2012, 12:09:36 PM
The 3rd trinket @dt is easier than the 2nd one. Also, I can do a slight change with the 2nd trinket if people find it too frustrating (hard is OK, frustrating is bad).

It's very hard. However, I don't think it's very annoying, so it's not frustrating.
The 3rd is easier than the 2nd? That's strange... or did you originally wanted the 3rd to be harder and didn't want to change? I didn't try the 3rd yet.
I'll try getting those 2 trinkets some hours later. After that, I might as well give a rating to this level... I only did that twice so far, but yes.
Correct. I don't really want to change established challenges unless I find them way too easy or way too hard/frustrating.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: Piplup1122 on December 19, 2012, 01:35:23 PM
Good level you got there. Hard, but fun.  :viridian:
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: blue626 on December 22, 2012, 12:52:32 PM
I finally completed this level with all 20 trinkets! I died ≈1460 times.

Rating:

Originality: I don' think there's any level that's a sequel to the main game besides the conversion to player levels of the demakes. The teleporting system was original, not only for being a teleporting system, but because terminals telport Viridian. A modified Dimension VVVVVV, I don't think there's another level like this... Oh, and the trinket room. Rating: 7/10 :verdigris:
Level structure: I like levels with sub-levels that you can do at any order and trinkets in the overworld. Not to mention the teleporters. However, maybe it would be better for a shortcut to the part of the DT after the Polar Dimension after you activated all PSs (and get the ending screen with the scorees)? Rating: 8/10 :viridian:
Story/Roomnames: I liked it. What happened before the main game was explained. And like the fact that this is a sequel to the game. :) ... Roomnames were normal, besiddes the fact that in the DT, it's always the same room name. Not to mention the Tetris reference, even if that isn't related to the story. Rating: 9/10 :viridian:
Visual Design: Nothing interesting, but I never saw any 1-tile thin walls or floating spikes. Rating: 8/10 :viridian:
Difficulty Balance: Note: You get a high rating for having medium difficulty and a low score for being too hard/easy. The hardest level besides The Final Level was Platform Arean, the 2nd hardest being the 4th I played (Life Factory?). I died more 180 times before I got the 19th trinket. I only died 34 times to get the 20th! :o Also I think that at least ≈75 of the deaths were entering and exiting the DT for at least the 2nd time (to get the trinkets). I would say that the level is slightly hard in general. Rating: 7/10 :verdigris:
Glitch Amount: I felt like discounting something due to the fact that there Int. Scr., but I'm not suggesting you to remove it. There were some Viridian textboxes that were gray and the flip sound at the end of Platform Arena. In the last dialog, I suppose that :victoria: is the speaker of the 2nd text box? The textbox is cyan. Rating: 8/10 :viridian:
Other Notes: I don't really understand what were you and avengah talking about in page 6 of this thread (considering that you have 15 replies/page). I never found the 21st trinket.
In the letter that Vita wrote, she said that there was something at the PS at the Platform Arena when there was nothing. Did I misread something?
At the ship, I think you need to warn that the terminal that teleports you to the Gravitron does that, so that you don't need to suicide.
You put me on the credits terminal! :o I guess I already started playing v.1.1.... so I don't know why... well I already commented, so it can stay.
Total rating: 16 :shiny: /20
Currently my 4th favorite level of those I completed, but I didn't complete many...

Also, this is my 500th post. How fitting!
EDIT: This was also the 500th post of the month in the whole forum. :o Interesting!
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on December 22, 2012, 02:04:12 PM
About putting a shortcut to the second part of DT -- well, I *do* have 1 teleporter left to use before I run out of space.. :)

I'll think about it.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: Rioshoa on January 12, 2013, 07:30:38 PM
Hello anybody and everybody!

Haven't done a VVVVVV Level in a while, and I keep saying I'm gonna get back to it.  Well the good toaster has been talking to me (I need to get that checked) and now I am gonna do this level and post the gameplay so you can get my thoughts as soon as I think of them.

www.youtube.com/Rioshoa

I'll be posting sometime tomorrow but there's my channel for now, I always love spreading my name when possible all the same
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: Rioshoa on January 13, 2013, 02:41:55 PM
Hello one and all, now able to get my initial thoughts from the horses mouth:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=15k58F6EX6c

First impressions are important so here you are getting them and then some.  If you like what you see then check out what else I have on my channel, you never know what you might find, and if not...well meh.  http://www.youtube.com/Rioshoa
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on January 13, 2013, 03:27:11 PM
Hello one and all, now able to get my initial thoughts from the horses mouth:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=15k58F6EX6c

First impressions are important so here you are getting them and then some.  If you like what you see then check out what else I have on my channel, you never know what you might find, and if not...well meh.  http://www.youtube.com/Rioshoa
I enjoyed to watch that!

Space Station is one of the few mostly unchanged place, actually.

About the odd bug in the first custom when there's no dialog text, that's a bug in VVVVVV which I didn't find a solution for. So they're like that at the moment.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: Rioshoa on January 13, 2013, 06:12:12 PM
Well I'm liking it so far all the same, and I hope you like the playthough.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: nicholashin on January 14, 2013, 05:37:29 AM
Awesome level, man. It's some super powerful scripting used extremely well!
I notice that if I go like T0 with TD destination-->TD terminal, it will toggle the script calling me to go to the Tower =.=
I haven't found all trinkets...I couldn't do the trinkets in DT!
It's a very good level  :viridian:
 

EDIT: Almost forget, but You Thought It was Easy made me cry. I managed it though. It's funny that I played quite well in all other rooms in that area as I designed a conveyor level with dodging enemies and I found stuff like Narrow Path easy  :vitellary:
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on January 14, 2013, 09:04:31 AM
Awesome level, man. It's some super powerful scripting used extremely well!
I notice that if I go like T0 with TD destination-->TD terminal, it will toggle the script calling me to go to the Tower =.=
I haven't found all trinkets...I couldn't do the trinkets in DT!
It's a very good level  :viridian:
 

EDIT: Almost forget, but You Thought It was Easy made me cry. I managed it though. It's funny that I played quite well in all other rooms in that area as I designed a conveyor level with dodging enemies and I found stuff like Narrow Path easy  :vitellary:
Hi. About the T0->TD issue, can you elaborate what happens more? I didn't quite follow what you said.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: nicholashin on January 17, 2013, 02:54:25 AM
1. Start in the control area.
2. Use the TD terminal.
3. Use the T0 terminal. You should arrive at the secret area.
4. Use the TD terminal in the secret area.
5. LEVEL PART COMPLETED message appears, then a dialogue.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on January 17, 2013, 06:12:47 AM
1. Start in the control area.
2. Use the TD terminal.
3. Use the T0 terminal. You should arrive at the secret area.
4. Use the TD terminal in the secret area.
5. LEVEL PART COMPLETED message appears, then a dialogue.
Thanks, I found the issue and it will be solved in 1.2 along with some other oversights.

If you find this a big nuisance, you can currently work-around it by not having Potential for Anything activated as the soundtrack. Having it causes two minor glitches, the TD issues you have and the materializer in secret area having a weird ending dialog.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: Rioshoa on January 20, 2013, 07:23:51 AM
Continuing through my playthrough of Back to VVVVVV. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FCZO8_WnECY

And of course, some self promotion: http://www.youtube.com/Rioshoa
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on January 20, 2013, 09:36:40 AM
Continuing through my playthrough of Back to VVVVVV. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FCZO8_WnECY

And of course, some self promotion: http://www.youtube.com/Rioshoa
I see that you had a little trouble with the maze :P

Also, sorry for that terminal in Crossway. Every terminal which mentions some kind of map checks which version you have to give a fallback message except for that one. That's an oversight for me, and I'll fix it for 1.2.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: Rioshoa on January 21, 2013, 04:33:02 AM
If it really bothered me, I'd have gone and updated my version, don't worry about it.

Fun fact, I decided to record this early, aka, Friday night.  I woke up Saturday Morning sick as a dog.  I'm still super sick.  Good thing I recorded when I did
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: Rioshoa on January 27, 2013, 06:42:13 PM
Now up, Episode 3:  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DJgbPiPvtfs&feature=youtu.be

And for more awesomeness: http://www.youtube.com/Rioshoa
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on February 04, 2013, 05:54:40 AM
I was a little bored...

(http://i49.tinypic.com/24blz6r.png)

...so I made a way to access all the 7 levels in-game by a cheat menu. :3
Not done yet, though.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: Dav999 on February 04, 2013, 06:38:35 AM
I was a little bored...

(http://i49.tinypic.com/24blz6r.png)

...so I made a way to access all the 7 levels in-game by a cheat menu. :3
Not done yet, though.

:o That looks really cool!
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: ToasterApocalypse on February 04, 2013, 07:01:48 AM
I was a little bored...

(http://i49.tinypic.com/24blz6r.png)

...so I made a way to access all the 7 levels in-game by a cheat menu. :3
Not done yet, though.

HOLY CRAP I NEED TO KNOW HOW TO DO THAT
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on February 04, 2013, 07:28:07 AM
I was a little bored...

(http://i49.tinypic.com/24blz6r.png)

...so I made a way to access all the 7 levels in-game by a cheat menu. :3
Not done yet, though.

HOLY CRAP I NEED TO KNOW HOW TO DO THAT
You can look at the scripts in the level editor (they all start with levelselect) once 1.2 is released.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: FIQ on February 10, 2013, 05:12:17 PM
The cheat code system I thought up is coming along nicely. Once this thing is finished, and a playtest give no issues, I'll release Back to VVVVVV 1.2 with bugfixes and some new features, probably sometime in the coming week.

Also, I looked at the main post, and whoa, 76 downloads. :o
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.1)
Post by: FIQ on February 14, 2013, 08:28:23 AM
Sorry but I'll have to delay V1.2.

I've just run into a hard limit on the amount of scripts you can have in a level at the same time.

I hardly need more scripts than I already have (only about 20 max) to get V1.2 in the state I want, but I want to optimize away a noticeable amount of scripts so that I hardly ever stumble upon the limit again.

Until I've done this, I'll not be able to continue development.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.1)
Post by: Hejmstel on February 14, 2013, 04:59:31 PM
Sorry but I'll have to delay V1.2.

I've just run into a hard limit on the amount of scripts you can have in a level at the same time.

I hardly need more scripts than I already have (only about 20 max) to get V1.2 in the state I want, but I want to optimize away a noticeable amount of scripts so that I hardly ever stumble upon the limit again.

Until I've done this, I'll not be able to continue development.

(http://nooooooooooooooo.com/vader.jpg)
I had to
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.1)
Post by: FIQ on February 15, 2013, 04:40:01 PM
Optimizations are complete and I've resumed development. 1.2 will have several bug fixes and some new features, and will be released most likely in tomorrow. Due to the optimizations done, you will NOT be able to continue on an old save file, sorry, this wasn't the plan!

A non-final changelog can be seen in page 8.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.1)
Post by: FIQ on February 16, 2013, 11:39:35 AM
Version 1.2 has been released!

Changelog below:
* Fixed clearing Platform Arena playing a flip sound effect instead of the level complete song in some cirumstances
* Fixed using TD resulting in "Level part completed! @ Life Factory" dialog if you had Potential for Anything activated in jukebox
* Altered the terminal in Crossway to give a more useful hint for 2.0 users.
* Made trinket locator usable for 2.0 users
* Made a room right of the trinket locator which you can use to check which trinkets you've found and which you miss currently
* Made the terminal in Crossway usable for 2.0 users
* Made a trinket room available before the end
* Made a TF pointing to the second dimensional tunnel (disabled before you complete the first phase of the level)
* Created a visible divot in Teleporter Divot
* Made *all* rooms in Dimensional Tunnel "wrap", there used to be a few rooms which didn't.
* Fixed a bug in which Vitellary (and possibly Vita) would disappear when choosing teleporter destination.
* Cheat code system. Codes are listed at the ship.
* Altered Into The Platform Arena slightly.
* Buffed Flip Training
* Nerfed Better Safe Than Sorry, Right?
* Fixed a typo in a roomname (Walk Agsint The Flow -> Walk Against The Flow)
* Placed checkpoints in DT (polar -> VVVVVV) at the trinket paths to make you walk less
* Placed several new checkpoints in the overworld to prevent dying in the few spots you can die at taking you to somewhere else far away
* Made a terminal at DT before the trinkets which comments a little on them, just for fun
* Made several script optimizations to account for hard limit of 500 scripts per level
* Fixed several typos
* Fixed a bug in the initial cutscene that made text boxes not show up correctly, and then crash VVVVVV if you button mash ACTION
* Removed an enemy in Easier Than it Looks to prevent dying by sheer (un)luck (this isn't a nerf in practice)
* Added persistent Vermilion at the ship, explaining the gravitron terminals.
* Added a 22nd trinket challenge -- complete the game (activate polar PS with 20 trinkets) and only ever activate destination teleporters in the hub personally 2 times

If you want to try out cheats without beating the level, I also list them here:

Cheat codes are written by accessing the different teleport terminals in the hub. For example, 1337 means that you'll first turn on T1, then T3, then T3 once again, then T7. Once you've done this, use the terminal without a T(number) in the red room in the hub. Keep in mind that you do NOT have to have permission to use the different teleporter destination setters, codes will work even if you get "Permission denied!" when activating them.

Code list:
DEAD - Start over, kinda like a new game plus (Only available once you finish the level completely)
FEED - Spawn all the trinkets you've yet to collect (Doesn't include the 2 extra challenge trinkets)
1994 - Level Select Menu
1EE7 - Make the 4 primary levels (Life Factory, The Maze, Platform Arena, Inversed Floors) completed
53C7 - Open access to Secret Area (the area with a warp token denying access before you activate all power sources)
D357 - Make all teleporters available for use

Note that while I've tested doing the game with cheats, there might arise some issues if you sequence break using them (like going to DT without clearing all the other levels, etc).
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2)
Post by: FIQ on February 18, 2013, 04:27:28 AM
I realized that I forgot to fix two things in 1.2 that I intended to do. Thus, I'll release a 1.2.1 release. This also allows me to alter DT slightly, to make the trinkets a little easier. 1.2.1 has the following changes:
* Fixed a typo in the last dialog before the level ends
* Improved the dialog at the end to point out that the level will end immediately afterwards, and should you want to explore more, you're recommended to save
* Nerfed trinket challenges in Dimensional Tunnel
* Moved the DT challenge explanation terminal to the right side, to prevent users from accidentally skipping the first trinket (Riosha did this twice and I don't think it was intended)
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.1)
Post by: FIQ on March 22, 2013, 05:52:36 AM
I found some issues. While I'm mostly happy with how the level is right now, it would be cool if they were fixed.
I probably wont release a new version soon, though.

Things to do for an eventual 1.3:
* Fixed various (minor) tile errors in the level
* Moved T4 terminal a little to the right to prevent game complete amount of flips text to be hard to read due to it going through it.
* Decreased amount of minimun teleporters to get an extra challenge award at game completion from 2 to 1 due to an oversight (you can complete the game and only use the teleporters once, without abusing invincibility nor glitches).
* Maybe alter how special challenges are awarded, to work around the 2 star problem, and not have to do special handling for DIY VI Repair if you complete them.
* No Death mode
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.1)
Post by: ToasterApocalypse on March 22, 2013, 05:54:12 AM
* No Death mode

How would that work? Other level? Or a title screen like the level select menu?
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.1)
Post by: FIQ on March 22, 2013, 05:58:15 AM
* No Death mode

How would that work? Other level? Or a title screen like the level select menu?
EDIT: Turns out I might be wrong after doing some quick math. I'll investigate this to see if it's theoretically possible to merge the modes. However, due to the 500 script limit, I would have to do some optimizations most likely.

EDIT2: No, it wont work. First, it wont look good. Second, while it's possible if I reuse IDs, that would most likely introduce various bugs everywhere with checkpoints being lit when they shouldn't. So, no, I'll have to make it a different level.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.1)
Post by: Hejmstel on March 31, 2013, 03:15:26 PM
Quote from: FIQ
Hi. I've had some fun with the internal-script-activation bug. No, I'm not planning on using it in a submitted level. Actually that would be a very bad idea as I discovered that segfaults are a common thing when playing with this (Also I messed up my save one time :P )
It's funny how this statement has been rendered entirely invalid now
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.1)
Post by: FIQ on April 01, 2013, 07:50:00 AM
Quote from: FIQ
Hi. I've had some fun with the internal-script-activation bug. No, I'm not planning on using it in a submitted level. Actually that would be a very bad idea as I discovered that segfaults are a common thing when playing with this (Also I messed up my save one time :P )
It's funny how this statement has been rendered entirely invalid now
Meh, that was before I realized that if you know exactly what you're doing, you'll be fine.

If 2.2 was actually released with more powerful simplified scripting, I have a feeling this wouldn't exist (and if it would, it wouldn't be like this). It started out as a proof of concept of what you could do with internal scripting, but ended up being a fully playable level (and according to most people, a good one!)
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.1)
Post by: Hennal on April 16, 2013, 10:00:47 AM
Whoa, the level is totally awesome  :viridian:
but how did you replicate rooms of the real game?
 
 10 / 10
 :shiny:
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.1)
Post by: Hejmstel on April 16, 2013, 03:49:09 PM
Yeah, I kinda wondered that myself. He made an exact copy of Dimension VVVVVV... did he copy all the rooms of the game by hand? ???
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.1)
Post by: Hennal on April 17, 2013, 09:15:50 AM
Yeah, I kinda wondered that myself. He made an exact copy of Dimension VVVVVV... did he copy all the rooms of the game by hand? ???
Hmmm...
My suspicion is he copied D. VVVVVV room data into his level and then edited them. (if you can do that)
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.1)
Post by: TheJonyMyster on May 05, 2013, 06:57:28 AM
THE ULTIMATE TRINKETS ARE BROKEN.  >:(
I don't want to get them, but there's no way out of there!
:'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'(
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.1)
Post by: FIQ on May 05, 2013, 07:21:22 AM
THE ULTIMATE TRINKETS ARE BROKEN.  >:(
I don't want to get them, but there's no way out of there!
:'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'(
You should be able to go left and wrap to the easy part.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.1)
Post by: Samario on May 26, 2013, 04:13:09 AM
I found a ...interesting... bug. After playing through the map, I went to create a new level, expanded it to 20x20, then parts of the map appeared on it!
This... shouldn't be happening. Does ANYONE have an explanation for this?
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.1)
Post by: Dav999 on May 26, 2013, 04:43:05 AM
I found a ...interesting... bug. After playing through the map, I went to create a new level, expanded it to 20x20, then parts of the map appeared on it!
This... shouldn't be happening. Does ANYONE have an explanation for this?

Wow. Which parts of the map appeared?
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.1)
Post by: Samario on May 26, 2013, 07:01:11 AM
I found a ...interesting... bug. After playing through the map, I went to create a new level, expanded it to 20x20, then parts of the map appeared on it!
This... shouldn't be happening. Does ANYONE have an explanation for this?

Wow. Which parts of the map appeared?

Editor coordinates 1,16 through to 20,20. No objects, no roomnames, no wrapping, no scripts, no tileset specified, just... there.

EDIT: Off-topic: 10th post!

 
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.1)
Post by: Samario on May 28, 2013, 02:27:40 PM
Quote from: Back To VVVVVV Level Select
"Instable Polar Dimension"
Shouldn't it be UNstable Polar Dimension?

Quote from: Captain Viridian, VVVVVV polar destabilizing cutscene
"That doesn't sound too well..."
Um... it's "That doesn't sound too GOOD..." (not being grammarnazi, just OCD about this stuff).

Also, WHY ISN'T THIS A FEATURED LEVEL?!

Quote from: Back to VVVVVV's Final Level
Dimension Stability - 40-90%
That just doesn't sound right to me. Maybe it should be Dimensional Stability (I don't know why it says dimentional is wrong...) , Dimention's Stability, or Dimention Instability - it just doesn't sound right to me (no grammarnazi here, just an opinion).
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.1)
Post by: Hejmstel on May 28, 2013, 06:04:40 PM
Also, WHY ISN'T THIS A FEATURED LEVEL?!

Well, Terry hasn't featured any VVVVVV levels since... I dunno, 2 years ago? He doesn't seem to care about VVVVVV all that much any more, he's moved on to other projects. (Although, if he *was* still featuring levels this definately should have been featured)
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.1)
Post by: Samario on May 29, 2013, 12:21:32 AM
Just asking a question - how do I get the grey backgrounds seen in your and VVVVVV's polar dimension(s)?
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.1)
Post by: allison on May 29, 2013, 06:21:25 AM
Just asking a question - how do I get the grey backgrounds seen in your and VVVVVV's polar dimension(s)?

Edit the level externally with a text editor. Find the edLevelClass with your roomname. Change tilecol to 6.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.1)
Post by: Samario on May 29, 2013, 11:26:37 AM
Insert quote Here

Edit the level externally with a text editor. Find the edLevelClass with your roomname. Change tilecol to 6.

Thanks.

EDIT: Some testing later,
(http://imageshack.us/a/img541/4702/vvvvvvbugs.png)
THIS happens.  ???
(the one on the left is the one I wanted to make grey - it had that effect on the one on the right)
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.1)
Post by: FIQ on May 29, 2013, 03:03:07 PM
Quote from: Back To VVVVVV Level Select
"Instable Polar Dimension"
Shouldn't it be UNstable Polar Dimension?

Quote from: Captain Viridian, VVVVVV polar destabilizing cutscene
"That doesn't sound too well..."
Um... it's "That doesn't sound too GOOD..." (not being grammarnazi, just OCD about this stuff).

Also, WHY ISN'T THIS A FEATURED LEVEL?!
Thanks for pointing out spelling/grammar issues! English isn't my main language, that's why they are there. I'll make sure to incorporate these fixes if I release 1.3 at some point.

I doubt Terry would feature this, he hasn't even commented on the level. Not sure if he even played it :P

Terry did talk about featuring Dimension Funland though, and that would be his first featured level since months.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.1)
Post by: Lord Ghetsis on June 14, 2013, 01:43:18 PM
AMAZING. 9.99/10.
Things i liked:
The Maze segment: best use of warp lines I have ever seen.
Final level: wild ride! Loved it
The internal scripting in general
One annoyance: the Game Complete thing in T4 messed up my saves and unlocked Flip Mode. But very good. Make another!
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.1)
Post by: FIQ on June 14, 2013, 11:14:14 PM
AMAZING. 9.99/10.
Things i liked:
The Maze segment: best use of warp lines I have ever seen.
Final level: wild ride! Loved it
The internal scripting in general
One annoyance: the Game Complete thing in T4 messed up my saves and unlocked Flip Mode. But very good. Make another!
Activating Flip Mode is an oversight, I'll look into this and fix it ASAP.

But how exactly was saves "messed up"? They shouldn't become like that, and it never happened to me!
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.1)
Post by: allison on June 15, 2013, 08:51:11 AM
Insert quote Here

Edit the level externally with a text editor. Find the edLevelClass with your roomname. Change tilecol to 6.

Thanks.

EDIT: Some testing later,
(http://imageshack.us/a/img541/4702/vvvvvvbugs.png)
THIS happens.  ???
(the one on the left is the one I wanted to make grey - it had that effect on the one on the right)

I'm not sure about the one on the left, but the one on the right's problem seems to be that it wasn't set to the Warp Zone tileset.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.1)
Post by: FIQ on June 15, 2013, 11:42:15 AM
There's spikes from Tower Tileset on the right screenshot. Why?
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.1)
Post by: Lord Ghetsis on June 15, 2013, 11:59:04 AM
AMAZING. 9.99/10.
Things i liked:
The Maze segment: best use of warp lines I have ever seen.
Final level: wild ride! Loved it
The internal scripting in general
One annoyance: the Game Complete thing in T4 messed up my saves and unlocked Flip Mode. But very good. Make another!
Activating Flip Mode is an oversight, I'll look into this and fix it ASAP.

But how exactly was saves "messed up"? They shouldn't become like that, and it never happened to me!
Overreaction. It just said that i had unlocked flipmode, and I got scared.
EDIT: want to say yay! my concern got into the original post!
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.1)
Post by: Lord Ghetsis on June 15, 2013, 12:02:45 PM
Just asking a question - how do I get the grey backgrounds seen in your and VVVVVV's polar dimension(s)?

Edit the level externally with a text editor. Find the edLevelClass with your roomname. Change tilecol to 6.
Or use Direct Mode. Only in 2.1.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.1)
Post by: allison on June 15, 2013, 01:10:51 PM
There's spikes from Tower Tileset on the right screenshot. Why?

It looks like it's the custom tiles he's using; you can see custom font too.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.1)
Post by: Samario on June 16, 2013, 02:04:33 AM
-insert quote here-

It looks like it's the custom tiles he's using; you can see custom font too.
Yeah, I'd inserted tiles from tiles3.png into tiles2.png.
The one on the left was supposed to be grey, but stayed blue.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.1)
Post by: FIQ on June 16, 2013, 11:20:38 AM
I fixed the flip mode unlocked bug. The solution was trivial, but I had to replace the "Game complete!" textbox by a "Level complete!" one (which, IMO, is better than making a custom "GAME COMPLETE" textbox which looks way worse), as forcing the game to show the former makes it unlock flip mode as a side effect, w/o the possibility to cancel the process in the middle (as it's loaded on the same "gamestate" as the gamecomplete window).

I'll put up a fix shortly after solving a couple of other minor bugs.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.1)
Post by: Dav999 on June 16, 2013, 11:33:58 AM
I fixed the flip mode unlocked bug. The solution was trivial, but I had to replace the "Game complete!" textbox by a "Level complete!" one (which, IMO, is better than making a custom "GAME COMPLETE" textbox which looks way worse), as forcing the game to show the former makes it unlock flip mode as a side effect, w/o the possibility to cancel the process in the middle (as it's loaded on the same "gamestate" as the gamecomplete window).

I'll put up a fix shortly after solving a couple of other minor bugs.

How about the other info like amount of flips and deaths, and hardest room?
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.1)
Post by: FIQ on June 16, 2013, 03:14:18 PM
I fixed the flip mode unlocked bug. The solution was trivial, but I had to replace the "Game complete!" textbox by a "Level complete!" one (which, IMO, is better than making a custom "GAME COMPLETE" textbox which looks way worse), as forcing the game to show the former makes it unlock flip mode as a side effect, w/o the possibility to cancel the process in the middle (as it's loaded on the same "gamestate" as the gamecomplete window).

I'll put up a fix shortly after solving a couple of other minor bugs.

How about the other info like amount of flips and deaths, and hardest room?
Those are left intact.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.2)
Post by: FIQ on June 16, 2013, 03:28:27 PM
Back to VVVVVV 1.2.2 has been released.

Changelog:
* Fixed completing the first part of the level unlocking Flip Mode
* Fixed typos: instable->unstable, (...) sound too well... -> (...) sound too good...
* Fixed a minor tiling error in Inversed Floors
* Moved T4 slightly to the right
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.2)
Post by: Lord Ghetsis on June 22, 2013, 09:55:18 AM
Changelog:
* Fixed completing the first part of the level unlocking Flip Mode
Thanks. Now i don't have to clear data every time i replay... :viridian:
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: weee50 on July 04, 2013, 02:41:49 PM

The normal path. The actual difficulty wasn't much. It was just memorising(Spelling?) the location of the spikes/enemies.

EDIT: I also died about 200 times in the platform arena  :D
It's memorizing.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: blue626 on July 04, 2013, 03:32:13 PM

The normal path. The actual difficulty wasn't much. It was just memorising(Spelling?) the location of the spikes/enemies.

EDIT: I also died about 200 times in the platform arena  :D
It's memorizing.

That's americn english. I think it's memorising in british english.
And, do you realize you made a 12 day bump and replied to a year-old post just because of spelling? :-\
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: weee50 on July 04, 2013, 04:20:47 PM

The normal path. The actual difficulty wasn't much. It was just memorising(Spelling?) the location of the spikes/enemies.

EDIT: I also died about 200 times in the platform arena  :D
It's memorizing.

That's americn english. I think it's memorising in british english.
And, do you realize you made a 12 day bump and replied to a year-old post just because of spelling? :-X
Another spelling error! That's american, not amaricn.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV
Post by: Dav999 on July 04, 2013, 05:15:02 PM
Can we please get back on topic?
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.2)
Post by: weee50 on July 16, 2013, 01:23:56 PM
Can we please get back on topic?
Yes!
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.2)
Post by: FIQ on March 30, 2014, 05:32:57 PM
So I felt like fooling around with VVVVVV the last week, and had some fun fooling around with some attempt at a "debug"/cheat menu ("debug" since I didn't really use it for debugging, even thought it could have been helpful had it been available as one). It was mostly intended for personal use for messing around with, but since others seemed to like it, I guess I could incorporate it available by the in-level cheat code system. It controls the same as my already existing level select, only with a far better looking UI.

Why? Because I can.

The result is this:
(http://home.fiq.se/debug_test.png)
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.2)
Post by: nicholashin on March 31, 2014, 04:12:36 AM
So I felt like fooling around with VVVVVV the last week, and had some fun fooling around with some attempt at a "debug"/cheat menu ("debug" since I didn't really use it for debugging, even thought it could have been helpful had it been available as one). It was mostly intended for personal use for messing around with, but since others seemed to like it, I guess I could incorporate it available by the in-level cheat code system. It controls the same as my already existing level select, only with a far better looking UI.

Why? Because I can.

The result is this:
(http://home.fiq.se/debug_test.png)
This looks EPIC!! The only problem is that this may get fixed in new version...
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.2)
Post by: allison on March 31, 2014, 05:41:32 AM
So I felt like fooling around with VVVVVV the last week, and had some fun fooling around with some attempt at a "debug"/cheat menu ("debug" since I didn't really use it for debugging, even thought it could have been helpful had it been available as one). It was mostly intended for personal use for messing around with, but since others seemed to like it, I guess I could incorporate it available by the in-level cheat code system. It controls the same as my already existing level select, only with a far better looking UI.

Why? Because I can.

The result is this:
[snip]
WHAT HOW
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.2)
Post by: Hennal on March 31, 2014, 07:25:57 AM
TELL ME HOW x11000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.2)
Post by: allison on April 01, 2014, 05:57:37 AM
11000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
fun fact: the result of this is 1
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.2)
Post by: Hennal on April 08, 2014, 09:32:01 AM
So I felt like fooling around with VVVVVV the last week, and had some fun fooling around with some attempt at a "debug"/cheat menu ("debug" since I didn't really use it for debugging, even thought it could have been helpful had it been available as one). It was mostly intended for personal use for messing around with, but since others seemed to like it, I guess I could incorporate it available by the in-level cheat code system. It controls the same as my already existing level select, only with a far better looking UI.

Why? Because I can.

The result is this:

<snip>
This looks EPIC!! The only problem is that this may get fixed in new version...

...Which will probably NEVER come out.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.2)
Post by: FIQ on April 15, 2014, 06:32:50 PM
So yeah, about that debug thing, VVVVVV 2.0 doesn't like it at all. And I don't want to spend work on something that might even break completely in the upcoming update as well, so I'll stall it for now.
However, I've looked into something else. Would anyone be masochistic enough to do a no death run of this level? : D
I've looked into areas which rely too much on Viridian's "jerky" movement (as Riosha would put it) making the areas being hard not because of the challenge but rather because of frustrating controls, to fix these, and then release a 1.3 with included No Death Mode and some other goodies to make it relevant for non-masochists as well.

Features in this case:
* No Death mode, including a cutscene toggle
* Gravitron chaining bug fix
* Replicated VVVVVV jukebox
* Trinket checker in Secret Area acknowledging the 22nd trinket
* A changed trinket challenge (this time without a forced restart)
* Adjustments of challenges relying on Viridian's "jerky movement"
* Improved level completed screens
* More crewmate interaction
* Major rework of intro cutscene - it's far too long as it is right now.
* Rework of the hub system. The hub system is rather cool IMO, but I would prefer using a system which works more like the main game does, and this is actually possible to implement in a feasible manner.
* maybe more?
Title: -
Post by: Info Teddy on April 15, 2014, 08:42:01 PM
So yeah, about that debug thing, VVVVVV 2.0 doesn't like it at all. And I don't want to spend work on something that might even break completely in the upcoming update as well, so I'll stall it for now.
However, I've looked into something else. Would anyone be masochistic enough to do a no death run of this level? : D
I've looked into areas which rely too much on Viridian's "jerky" movement (as Riosha would put it) making the areas being hard not because of the challenge but rather because of frustrating controls, to fix these, and then release a 1.3 with included No Death Mode and some other goodies to make it relevant for non-masochists as well.

Features in this case:
* No Death mode, including a cutscene toggle
* Gravitron chaining bug fix
* Replicated VVVVVV jukebox
* Trinket checker in Secret Area acknowledging the 22nd trinket
* A changed trinket challenge (this time without a forced restart)
* Adjustments of challenges relying on Viridian's "jerky movement"
* Improved level completed screens
* More crewmate interaction
* Major rework of intro cutscene - it's far too long as it is right now.
* Rework of the hub system. The hub system is rather cool IMO, but I would prefer using a system which works more like the main game does, and this is actually possible to implement in a feasible manner.
* maybe more?
You forgot the fact that you can st/\\ go to the po\ar d/mens/on a second t/me. On the second t/me, you can sk/p the cutscene that stab/\/zes the d/mens/on and run /nto the stab/\/zed vers/on of "The Gang's A\\ Here". / th/nk /t on\y works /after/ you go to the po\ar d/mens/on the f/rst t/me.

A\so, p\ease te\\ us how to get that debug th/ng. / see you're test/ng the \eve\ /ns/de the ed/tor, so sure\y /t must be some sort of gamestate or /nterna\ scr/pt.
or maybe you just edited the game
Title: Re: -
Post by: FIQ on April 16, 2014, 12:51:19 AM
So yeah, about that debug thing, VVVVVV 2.0 doesn't like it at all. And I don't want to spend work on something that might even break completely in the upcoming update as well, so I'll stall it for now.
However, I've looked into something else. Would anyone be masochistic enough to do a no death run of this level? : D
I've looked into areas which rely too much on Viridian's "jerky" movement (as Riosha would put it) making the areas being hard not because of the challenge but rather because of frustrating controls, to fix these, and then release a 1.3 with included No Death Mode and some other goodies to make it relevant for non-masochists as well.

Features in this case:
* No Death mode, including a cutscene toggle
* Gravitron chaining bug fix
* Replicated VVVVVV jukebox
* Trinket checker in Secret Area acknowledging the 22nd trinket
* A changed trinket challenge (this time without a forced restart)
* Adjustments of challenges relying on Viridian's "jerky movement"
* Improved level completed screens
* More crewmate interaction
* Major rework of intro cutscene - it's far too long as it is right now.
* Rework of the hub system. The hub system is rather cool IMO, but I would prefer using a system which works more like the main game does, and this is actually possible to implement in a feasible manner.
* maybe more?
You forgot the fact that you can st/\\ go to the po\ar d/mens/on a second t/me. On the second t/me, you can sk/p the cutscene that stab/\/zes the d/mens/on and run /nto the stab/\/zed vers/on of "The Gang's A\\ Here". / th/nk /t on\y works /after/ you go to the po\ar d/mens/on the f/rst t/me.

A\so, p\ease te\\ us how to get that debug th/ng. / see you're test/ng the \eve\ /ns/de the ed/tor, so sure\y /t must be some sort of gamestate or /nterna\ scr/pt.
or maybe you just edited the game
I don't understand what you mean with the second polar dimension visit. I'm aware that it happens. What is the issue?

As for the cheat menu interface, it is done by creating text manually using createentity() with inversion planes. Thus, a lot of entities is made. This causes VVVVVV 2.0 to crash for some reason, but the issue isn't present in 2.1.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.1)
Post by: vitellaryjr on April 28, 2014, 06:21:37 PM
I found a ...interesting... bug. After playing through the map, I went to create a new level, expanded it to 20x20, then parts of the map appeared on it!
This... shouldn't be happening. Does ANYONE have an explanation for this?
The same thing happened to me with Escape from the Lab!  ??? (not sure if name is exact)
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.2)
Post by: FIQ on June 13, 2014, 04:46:16 PM
Version 1.3 is coming along rather nicely. Expect a new version in due time. This will most likely be my final release (apart from potential bug fixes) until I start messing with other things.

The major new features are as follows (DISCLAIMER: may change for the final release):
* Improved intro cutscene
* Improved dialog
* New teleporter interface, replicating the main game teleporter system as good as possible
* Improved achievement system (to replace "challenge trinkets")
* Remixed Predestined Fate available for 2.2 users
* Challenges which rely too much on luck (as a result of VVVVVV being a bit slippery) altered
* Improved a few trinket challenges
* New purpose for the hub to replace old teleport system
* No Death mode (works similar to the main game)
* Time Trial mode (randomized level order, go through them all as fast as possible)
* Bug fixes
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.2)
Post by: stylzm on June 17, 2014, 11:28:08 AM
Version 1.3 is coming along rather nicely. Expect a new version in due time. This will most likely be my final release (apart from potential bug fixes) until I start messing with other things.

The major new features are as follows (DISCLAIMER: may change for the final release):
* Improved intro cutscene
* Improved dialog
* New teleporter interface, replicating the main game teleporter system as good as possible
* Improved achievement system (to replace "challenge trinkets")
* Remixed Predestined Fate available for 2.2 users
* Challenges which rely too much on luck (as a result of VVVVVV being a bit slippery) altered
* Improved a few trinket challenges
* New purpose for the hub to replace old teleport system
* No Death mode (works similar to the main game)
* Time Trial mode (randomized level order, go through them all as fast as possible)
* Bug fixes
Wait, 2.2 is out?!
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.2)
Post by: FIQ on June 19, 2014, 12:48:00 PM
2.2 made it impossible to access Super Gravitron if you're invincible. This level bypasses this alltogether, so depending on what is done regarding the *other* current method (talking to Victoria), I'll either push a 1.2.3 fix or a 1.3 fix that does this as well.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.2)
Post by: Starspire on September 07, 2015, 11:10:55 AM
Hey FIQ, is it okay if I use some of Vita's crew in my levels?
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.2)
Post by: SJMistery on September 09, 2015, 06:33:23 AM
MEGA BUMP
Vultatrix, you better do this via MP like i did when i tried to contact some old users to take on and finish their respective unfinished prototypes.
Dimension Open uses Vita and makes some extra people from his crew to appear (Viel, Verisix and Voon, and i think some people include Valso on the crew), so it's perfectly okay for you to use them
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.2)
Post by: Starspire on September 09, 2015, 07:53:55 AM
Okat thanks. I only use Make and Play Edition general. :viridian:
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.2)
Post by: SJMistery on September 09, 2015, 11:27:58 PM
Dimension Open, also named the Open Level Project or tOLP, is, obviously, a humongous player level, not another edition of the game...
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.2)
Post by: Starspire on September 18, 2015, 07:09:50 PM
Was Verisix ever part of Vita's crew...?  :vitellary:
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.2)
Post by: SJMistery on September 19, 2015, 02:17:22 AM
nop, it was an old member of the viridian crew that in one player level got lost in time and was supposed dead
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.2)
Post by: Starspire on September 19, 2015, 09:09:35 AM
Oh, so Verisix's debut was NOT in Dimension Open? Do you know which level it is?
 
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.2)
Post by: allison on September 19, 2015, 10:28:37 AM
Oh, so Verisix's debut was NOT in Dimension Open? Do you know which level it is?
I think it was Dimension Switchback.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.2)
Post by: som1sezhi on September 19, 2015, 11:00:12 AM
Oh, so Verisix's debut was NOT in Dimension Open? Do you know which level it is?
I think it was Dimension Switchback.
that was vertigo
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.2)
Post by: Starspire on September 24, 2015, 07:22:23 PM
I think Verisix's debut was Dimension Open
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.2)
Post by: allison on September 24, 2015, 08:22:46 PM
I think Verisix's debut was Dimension Open
He definitely debuted before then.

...Just looked it up, apparently it was "Crash Landing". I forgot that level even existed to be honest  :P
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.2)
Post by: AllyTally ♡ on September 25, 2015, 02:47:28 PM
Please please PLEASE Tell me how to do the level select thing! I need to know!
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.2)
Post by: @Kreator on September 25, 2015, 02:55:18 PM
the c6f wiki needs some serious updating

it's the only thing about c6f that could possibly be useful in any way
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.2)
Post by: Starspire on September 25, 2015, 03:19:33 PM
I think Verisix's debut was Dimension Open
He definitely debuted before then.

...Just looked it up, apparently it was "Crash Landing". I forgot that level even existed to be honest  :P

Wait... where can I find that level and who is it by?
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.2)
Post by: Co-Captain Void on September 26, 2015, 08:49:55 AM
Woh. How in VVVVVV could u even DO the level part complete bit?  :viridian: :viridian: :viridian: :viridian: :viridian: :viridian:
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.2)
Post by: Starspire on September 26, 2015, 10:13:16 AM
Woh. How in VVVVVV could u even DO the level part complete bit?  :viridian: :viridian: :viridian: :viridian: :viridian: :viridian:

You mean the Level Complete screen/ I think it's custom-made in Internal Scripting.

Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.3)
Post by: FIQ on April 14, 2016, 05:45:32 PM
Added version 1.2.3 that makes the super gravitron no longer accessible under invincibility mode, for 2.2 consistency.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.3)
Post by: SJMistery on April 15, 2016, 12:46:00 AM
Interesting. Nice to see you back!
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.3)
Post by: NeoKat on August 04, 2016, 03:55:05 AM
BUMP. Please help! I turned on PS's in Platform Arena, The Maze and Inversed Floors. 2 remain. 1 of them is in the Tower. Where do I find another one?!
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.3)
Post by: LafondaSaysMeow on August 04, 2016, 05:34:25 AM
BUMP. Please help! I turned on PS's in Platform Arena, The Maze and Inversed Floors. 2 remain. 1 of them is in the Tower. Where do I find another one?!
NOTE: Below is spoilers, highlight if you want to know.
Near that place where you enter the tower in the main game, there is a tunnel that takes you a place called the life factory, and another PS is there.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.3)
Post by: NeoKat on August 05, 2016, 03:38:56 AM
I finished it. It was AWESOME! But there's 1 closed room on the map. Looks like that it's inaccsessible. How to get inside?  :vitellary:
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.3)
Post by: LafondaSaysMeow on August 05, 2016, 05:15:34 AM
I think it might be one of the gravitrons.
At the end you can fill up 3 rooms with gravitrons, since the super gravitron gamestate to bring you back works like that.
If there is still a missing room, then I think you just simply missed it.
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.3)
Post by: NeoKat on August 05, 2016, 06:37:46 AM
Yes, it was the normal gravitron. I thought it'll be the old one. Thanks!
Title: Re: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.1)
Post by: FIQ on December 14, 2018, 06:33:32 PM
Yeah, I kinda wondered that myself. He made an exact copy of Dimension VVVVVV... did he copy all the rooms of the game by hand? ???
Hmmm...
My suspicion is he copied D. VVVVVV room data into his level and then edited them. (if you can do that)
IIRC using strings on the binary gives you tile data you can copy/paste manually into the XML to copy the dimension tiles.