Author Topic: Back to VVVVVV (V1.2.3)  (Read 79242 times)

FIQ

  • Captain
  • *****
  • Posts: 810
  • https://github.com/FredrIQ/
    • View Profile
    • FIQ
Re: Back to VVVVVV
« Reply #75 on: October 14, 2012, 10:51:31 AM »
All right! I played it again and I made a bug list:
Thanks!

Press ENTER to activate terminal during the first cutscene
I'm aware of this, it wasn't exactly intended but it just became like this. I can move Viridian a bit at the start if it looks wrong!

Sometimes, during a cutscene with dialogues, the game just waits until you press enter, I guess there was supposed to be a text box there, but it didn't appear
This mostly happens on the first dialog (does it happen otherwise at all?) I cannot work-around this I believe. The "missing" dialogs are placeholders (there isn't any meaningful text there) as I was aware of it.

Some room names are different ('Chinese Room' should be called 'Chinese Rooms', 'Seeing Dollar $ign$' is actually called '$eeing Dollar $ign$', and 'The Hanged Man, Reverse' should be 'The Hanged Man, Reversed' but those are just small details)
Thanks, I'll fix them.

[grammar-nazi-mode]Some grammar mistakes (like Two Remains, One Remain, and 'Every source isn't on yet')[/grammar-nazi-mode]
English isn't my first language, what is correct @ "X remains"? I'll fix the latter.

You still can't use teleporter terminals to set the destination twice without leaving the room (same for the jukebox) ???
I only fixed one of the terminal "groups", I forgot the others. I will look into it!
« Last Edit: October 14, 2012, 10:54:45 AM by FIQ »

Dav999

  • Global Moderator
  • Captain
  • *****
  • Posts: 2173
    • View Profile
    • The Open Level Project
Re: Back to VVVVVV
« Reply #76 on: October 14, 2012, 11:33:28 AM »
[grammar-nazi-mode]Some grammar mistakes (like Two Remains, One Remain, and 'Every source isn't on yet')[/grammar-nazi-mode]
English isn't my first language, what is correct @ "X remains"? I'll fix the latter.

1 remains, 2 remain, 3 remain, etc.

Dav999

  • Global Moderator
  • Captain
  • *****
  • Posts: 2173
    • View Profile
    • The Open Level Project
Re: Back to VVVVVV
« Reply #77 on: October 15, 2012, 03:41:47 AM »
I have a suggestion. If you change the music with the jukebox, the music will switch back to Popular Potpurri after you use the materializer, or if you go back to that area. (where TD is, I don't know how that area is called) Maybe it's a good idea to use flags for that, if there are enough left?

FIQ

  • Captain
  • *****
  • Posts: 810
  • https://github.com/FredrIQ/
    • View Profile
    • FIQ
Re: Back to VVVVVV
« Reply #78 on: October 15, 2012, 08:33:38 AM »
I have a suggestion. If you change the music with the jukebox, the music will switch back to Popular Potpurri after you use the materializer, or if you go back to that area. (where TD is, I don't know how that area is called) Maybe it's a good idea to use flags for that, if there are enough left?
I did my best to use as little flags as possible, which led to very repetive scripts every now and then, just in case I needed more flags later. Currently there is 41 left that isn't reserved. (Also 21 flags that is reserved but not used, so there's plenty left). If I do this, this will cost 4+4 flags, so I'll end up with 33 flags left. Worth it? In terms of flags, sure! Whether I will actually do it is another question...

I thought of making the music stay actually but never did it. I might implement this :P

EDIT: Always fun when the script completly refuses to load my script properly but instead just stopping, and debugging doesn't give much at all!

EDIT: Oh please...
« Last Edit: October 15, 2012, 09:33:32 AM by FIQ »

FIQ

  • Captain
  • *****
  • Posts: 810
  • https://github.com/FredrIQ/
    • View Profile
    • FIQ
Re: Back to VVVVVV
« Reply #79 on: October 23, 2012, 01:37:08 PM »
Couldn't get dynamic music to work because scripts for some reason just refuse to load properly.  :victoria:
In general, making new script calls in my level nowdays make really odd behaviour and usually doesn't work at all. Probably because I have pretty many scripts...

Oh well, I'll fix the rest of the things you reported and upload a new version!
« Last Edit: October 23, 2012, 01:58:35 PM by FIQ »

FIQ

  • Captain
  • *****
  • Posts: 810
  • https://github.com/FredrIQ/
    • View Profile
    • FIQ
Re: Back to VVVVVV
« Reply #80 on: October 31, 2012, 02:09:20 PM »
Progress (I will do these things before releasing an update):
* Fixed grammatical errors in "PS activated!" text (done)
* Changed some internal scripts to use the "internal scripting w/o cutscenebars" method (done)
* Trinket room! Yay! (done)
* Jukebox terminals in secret area is reusable now (done)
* The secret area now remembers which music it played last (done)
* The jukebox at the end of the game will also remember what music it played last (done)
* Fixed "Press ACTION to activate terminal" at the beginning (done)
* Changed the background of the alternative path in Life Factory (done)
* You can't die in Secret Area anymore (by enemies from Platform Arena) (done)
* Terminals in Control Area that set destination is reusable now (done)
* Now there's an use for the leftmost terminal in Control Area (Not yet)
* Fixed a major bug letting you get infinite trinkets (done)
* Moved the terminals in the center "Control Area" to fix an occasional glitch (done)
* Made a trinket more interesting. As this resulted in moving a trinket, and due to how VVVVVV handles entities in custom levels, this WILL break saves (unless you collected all, or no, trinkets) (done)
* Made a place in overworld less frustrating (done)
* A last playthrough to debug everything (done)
« Last Edit: November 10, 2012, 06:08:57 AM by FIQ »

avengah

  • Professor
  • ****
  • Posts: 117
    • View Profile
Re: Back to VVVVVV
« Reply #81 on: November 07, 2012, 03:19:06 PM »
I've encountered another couple of bugs, I'm afraid. Firstly, a minor bug - if you do Platform Arena third, go back without using a teleporter and then do the Smart People level fourth, you'll get the congratulatory message for the Smart People level, along with "One remains", and then you'll speak to Vita and Vitellary. If you then use any teleporter and come back, you'll get the congratulatory message for Platform Arena along with "One remains" again, Vita will still be there and you'll have the normal conversation with Vita (which is mostly the same as the conversation with Vita and Vitellary, except it automatically sends you to T1).

Now, the slightly more major bug. I did Plaform Arena third and Smart People fourth but didn't use an extra teleporter, thus skipping the congratulatory message for Platform Arena. After the Polar Dimension and secret area, I went back to TA and back through the Platform Arena again - and ended up with 22 trinkets. So for some reason the game allowed me to get the bonus trinket for a second time. I haven't looked at the scripts to determine a cause. I'll try a couple more things now.

Having 22 trinkets means two things - firstly you can skip one of the existing trinkets, and secondly your unlock file will say your highest number of collected trinkets will be 22. (In case anyone didn't know, collecting trinkets in a player level counts towards unlocking jukebox songs in the main game, as it saves the highest number you collect.)

EDIT: After a brief test, I seem to have found out that Life Factory makes the Platform Arena bonus trinket available again. I did Platform Arena first, then the Maze, then warped to TA and couldn't get it. Then I did Life Factory, warped to TA and did get it. I'll try a few more things. Maybe a flag is set in Life Factory that makes this trinket re-collectible?

EDIT 2: OK, the bonus trinket can be collected INFINITE times. Simply set the teleporter to T3, warp there ("There We Go!"), warp back, warp to TA and go back through Platform Arena. Every time you do this, you get an extra trinket.

EDIT 3: More fun. If you manage to get 21 trinkets before going to the Polar Dimension PS for the first time (get 19 before entering the Dimensional Tunnel), it skips the whole destabilising thing, and you end up back at the ship with a glitchy text box showing four lines of internal script, then the script stops leaving you on the ship. (Skipping the bit where you'd normally speak to your crew then go back to read a letter from Vita.) I'm also thinking that a side effect of the glitch may be that using T3 after collecting this trinket makes the game think you've not collected the bonus trinket, therefore it would only expect you to need 20, not 21 at the final PS. I've not confirmed that, though. A cursory look through the scripts makes me think this isn't the case, but I'm not sure. It's worth checking, though. I think the possible cause is that using T3 from Life Factory sets flag 99, which in turn allows you to get that bonus trinket since that's the flag checked when deciding whether to award it. I'm also assuming that the normal check inside the Platform Arena which decides whether to set flag 99 won't normally set it if you've already collected the trinket - but T3 sets flag 99 unconditionally.

Oh, and Tunnel T8 sets 99 too. I think you need to make sure that the trinket can still be collected if you don't get it straight away - let's say you come back later to Platform Arena, you should still be able to get it - but only once. So another flag might be required to ensure it's only collected once. And it's clear that Flag 99 is being used for two different things.
« Last Edit: November 07, 2012, 05:22:30 PM by avengah »

FIQ

  • Captain
  • *****
  • Posts: 810
  • https://github.com/FredrIQ/
    • View Profile
    • FIQ
Re: Back to VVVVVV
« Reply #82 on: November 08, 2012, 09:24:12 AM »
Thank you for pointing out that I accidentally re-use flag 99.
From now on, teleporting to TA from the hub will now automatically turn flag 99 off.
« Last Edit: November 08, 2012, 09:36:46 AM by FIQ »

Dav999

  • Global Moderator
  • Captain
  • *****
  • Posts: 2173
    • View Profile
    • The Open Level Project
Re: Back to VVVVVV
« Reply #83 on: November 08, 2012, 09:35:10 AM »
Thank you for pointing out that I accidentally re-use flag 99.
I'll switch the flag used for the bonus trinket, which will hopefully solve these problems.

I think everyone who makes a level with a lot of (internal) scripting should make a list with the used flags, and what they do, so they can easily see which flags were already used.

FIQ

  • Captain
  • *****
  • Posts: 810
  • https://github.com/FredrIQ/
    • View Profile
    • FIQ
Re: Back to VVVVVV
« Reply #84 on: November 08, 2012, 09:38:49 AM »
Thank you for pointing out that I accidentally re-use flag 99.
I'll switch the flag used for the bonus trinket, which will hopefully solve these problems.

I think everyone who makes a level with a lot of (internal) scripting should make a list with the used flags, and what they do, so they can easily see which flags were already used.
I already do that, the issue is that flag 90-99 is listed as "temporary flags". They're used for many things. They're always turned off before being used to prevent this from happening, I just forgot to turn it off in this case.

blue626

  • Captain
  • *****
  • Posts: 672
  • I changed my avatar!
    • View Profile
Re: Back to VVVVVV
« Reply #85 on: November 09, 2012, 11:08:10 AM »
Thank you for pointing out that I accidentally re-use flag 99.
I'll switch the flag used for the bonus trinket, which will hopefully solve these problems.

I think everyone who makes a level with a lot of (internal) scripting should make a list with the used flags, and what they do, so they can easily see which flags were already used.
I already do that, the issue is that flag 90-99 is listed as "temporary flags". They're used for many things. They're always turned off before being used to prevent this from happening, I just forgot to turn it off in this case.

If you use it, then check it. If you find another way of scripting that doesn't use that flag, then uncheck it. I don't see how listing temporary flags would help. ???

EDIT: Wait, I think I don't understand your post, as I confuse "uncheck" withn "turn off". Aren't flags alyways off before being used? I don't see why the other flags (0-89) would be on before they're used.. or I'm misunderstanding this (Note: I neither played the level nor looked into its scripts, but it's strange that flags are turned on before they're used).
« Last Edit: November 09, 2012, 11:13:48 AM by blue626 »

avengah

  • Professor
  • ****
  • Posts: 117
    • View Profile
Re: Back to VVVVVV
« Reply #86 on: November 09, 2012, 12:02:13 PM »
So if you're going to make sure Flag 99 is off if you teleport to TA from the hub, does this mean that the bonus trinket MUST be collected at the first possible opportunity? There must be a better solution.

My solution would be to set a permanent flag upon collecting the bonus trinket, and check this flag before awarding this bonus trinket.

Incidentally, why do you end up with four lines of internal script in a visible text box if you collect 21 trinkets before going to the Polar Dimension PS for the first time? What causes the internal script to end up being displayed?

Oh yeah, don't forget about that thing where if you do Platform Arena third and Life Factory fourth, you'll see Vitellary and Vita together, then if you warp out and back in you'll see Vita again before being automatically sent to T1. I don't know whether this is because it saves the Platform Arena congratulatory message or not, but it could be part of the reason.

EDIT: Unfortunately I can only upload ZIP files. So anyway, here's a zip containing a picture of the glitch along with a save so you can trigger it yourself. Simply go up to the PS and use it. I've got 21 trinkets with the glitch, and this is my first visit to the Polar Dimension; I've skipped the whole destabilisation thing. I want to know why this text box appears!

Text:

customposition(center)
speak_active
squeak(terminal)
text(gray,0,114,4)

Ah. I think I've got it! The script "diyvirepair_done" has a customifflag(41,diyvirepair_done2) command, but if flag 41 isn't set then the script ends. Since it's still in internal scripting mode, those four commands (which aren't in any script in the game) are displayed as text due to the lack of a loadscript(stop) command, I think. Is that right?
« Last Edit: November 09, 2012, 01:34:42 PM by avengah »

FIQ

  • Captain
  • *****
  • Posts: 810
  • https://github.com/FredrIQ/
    • View Profile
    • FIQ
Re: Back to VVVVVV
« Reply #87 on: November 09, 2012, 02:19:22 PM »
It was meant to only be able to collect the first time anyway, so fixing the "infinite trinkets" bug is first priority. Then, I can look into alternative solutions which allows this opportunity more than 1 time.

The reason for weirdness if you have "too many" trinkets is due to how I check stuff at the last PS. While this shouldn't really be possible at all, it shouldn't cause a glitch like that. The reason it happens at all is that I made this script before people told me the obvious real solution for a loadscripter (i.e. using "iftrinkets(0,script)" instead of a flag) which I hadn't realized by myself. As flag 41 isn't set yet at that moment, which it really should be in normal cirumstances, things glitch.

About the vita vs vitellary+vita bug, I'll solve the problem by making teleporting after the bonus mandatory instead of just encouraged.
« Last Edit: November 09, 2012, 02:27:48 PM by FIQ »

Dav999

  • Global Moderator
  • Captain
  • *****
  • Posts: 2173
    • View Profile
    • The Open Level Project
Re: Back to VVVVVV
« Reply #88 on: November 09, 2012, 02:39:40 PM »
If you don't want the game to say 21/20 trinkets, and give only one star, I think you can place a trinket in an inaccessible room with a text editor.

FIQ

  • Captain
  • *****
  • Posts: 810
  • https://github.com/FredrIQ/
    • View Profile
    • FIQ
Re: Back to VVVVVV
« Reply #89 on: November 09, 2012, 02:42:30 PM »
If you don't want the game to say 21/20 trinkets, and give only one star, I think you can place a trinket in an inaccessible room with a text editor.
I'd like that bonus trinket to stay hidden until you stumble upon it for yourself, so the max is going to stay at 20 :)

It's a shame that it only gives one star though, nothing I can do about it.